How long did/do you use your machines after OS EOL

Haydon · Feb 11, 2022

... and how did/do you keep it safe and secure running it on the Internet jungle?

cereberus · Feb 11, 2022

I do not think there is a simple answer to this question.

The only way you can guarantee any OS to be safe whether EOL or not EOL is to not connect to internet.

If you connect to an OS that is EOL, any weakness that has not been patched will remain unpatched (although MS have been known to patch some major issues after EOL but they are not guaranteed to always do that).

So no matter what anyone says, you cannot guarantee keeping an OS safe after EOL - all you can do is minimise the risk.

Of course, even if an OS is not EOL and a weakness identified, the PC is still at risk until it is patched. However, the risk is lower than an EOL OS provided the weakness is patched in a timely manner (but not until it is patched). One just hopes it gets patched before hackers start exploiting the weakness.

Given that no system is 100% risk free, then users should adopt an active approach e.g. ensuring data is backed up regularly. Taking a passive approach (relying on software alone) can fall apart in worst cases e.g. pc gets ransomed.

In any case, the biggest risks still come from click happy users clicking links without thinking of the consequence.

Winuser · Feb 11, 2022

I agree with @cereberus, EOL or not any device connected to the Internet is at risk. When MS stops updates for Windows 10 that doesn't necessarily mean that security updates will stop at the same time.

Berton · Feb 11, 2022

I have a Win7 and a WinXP, both quite usable Desktops but the WinXP is not on my Network or Internet. The Win7 is fine as long as an Anti-Virus program can be kept up-to-date.

Bree · Feb 11, 2022

Winuser said:
When MS stops updates for Windows 10 that doesn't necessarily mean that security updates will stop at the same time.

There will be no security updates for the Windows 10 OS after end of support.

Microsoft said:
Once a Microsoft operating system (OS) reaches the end of support, customers will no longer receive security updates.

Lifecycle FAQ - Windows

Answers to frequently asked questions about the lifecycle policy for Windows products.

docs.microsoft.com

The Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool and the Security Intelligence Update for Microsoft Defender Antivirus may well continue to be delivered though, but that's not the same thing as security patches for the OS. Windows 7 still gets the MSRT and definition updates for Microsoft Security Essentials through Windows Update.

Dch48 · Feb 11, 2022

I have never done it.

NavyLCDR · Feb 11, 2022

I like to live on the edge. I've never even came close to using an OS until EOL.....let alone beyond it!

Winuser · Feb 11, 2022

Bree said:
There will be no security updates for the Windows 10 OS after end of support.

How do know for sure that is true? MS could be saying that as a scare tactic to get user to switch to Win 11 earlier than they want too.

Winuser · Feb 11, 2022

NavyLCDR said:
I like to live on the edge. I've never even came close to using an OS until EOL.....let alone beyond it!

I'm not sure about what you're saying. I think your saying that even though you like to live on the edge, you won't run a OS till the end of it being supported. I didn't get much sleep last night so my brain is very fatigued.

Haydon · Feb 11, 2022

Bree said:
There will be no security updates for the Windows 10 OS after end of support.

Lifecycle FAQ - Windows

Answers to frequently asked questions about the lifecycle policy for Windows products.

docs.microsoft.com

The Windows Malicious Software Removal Tool and the Security Intelligence Update for Microsoft Defender Antivirus may well continue to be delivered though, but that's not the same thing as security patches for the OS. Windows 7 still gets the MSRT and definition updates for Microsoft Security Essentials through Windows Update.

... although W7 no longer get security patches for the OS.

Are there any AV vendors who specifically claim that they can nonetheless keep W7 protected?

Or do they all make a blanket claim 'we protect everything'

cereberus · Feb 11, 2022

Winuser said:
How do know for sure that is true? MS could be saying that as a scare tactic to get user to switch to Win 11 earlier than they want too.

MS have not said any such thing. All they have said is W11 is more secure which is technically correct albeit how much more secure is open to interpretation.

Re. EOL security - people are confusing getting AV updates post EOL with patching of security holes. The former can be avoided with 3rd party packages if MS do not continue them. Security holes will only be patched post EOL if truly critical and then only at MS's discretion. They obviously would have to decide on a case by case basis - it would be insane commercially to patch EOL OS's ad infinitum.

However, think about it - if a truly damaging security leak {potential to be widespread) was identified, and known to be exploited, MS's reputation could be seriously damaged if they took no action.

Reputation loss can kill shareholder value much faster than cost of avoiding issue as BP found out following Macondo oil leak. BP under invested in Macondo and the consequential share losses were collosal (to point where BP was vulnerable to a takeover).

Dch48 · Feb 11, 2022

Haydon said:
... although W7 no longer get security patches for the OS.

Are there any AV vendors who specifically claim that they can nonetheless keep W7 protected?

Or do they all make a blanket claim 'we protect everything'

My old laptop is triple booting 98SE, XP, and 7. I can tell you for a fact that the free Avast antivirus still supports XP and 7. You can get the version for XP and it will still receive definition updates but not updates to the program itself. The version for 7 has everything.

There are also versions of Firefox and CCleaner for XP but they do not get updates.

BrianInEngland · Feb 12, 2022

Never, I've always kept my OS up-to-date. I tend to upgrade hardware every 2-3 years

CornishRattler · Feb 12, 2022

Never come close to EOL on an OS, pretty much upgraded to the next OS as soon as possible mainly through insider programs or developer channels

Berton · Feb 12, 2022

NavyLCDR said:
I like to live on the edge. I've never even came close to using an OS until EOL.....let alone beyond it!

Winuser said:
I'm not sure about what you're saying. I think your saying that even though you like to live on the edge, you won't run a OS till the end of it being supported. I didn't get much sleep last night so my brain is very fatigued.

I think that's just pointing to when the Earth stops rotating the 'edge' will suddenly appear.

zbook · Feb 12, 2022

Whether an end user uses an operating system beyond EOL is dependent upon the factors considered.

For example there may be other factors beyond security such as specific features.

For Windows Microsoft has commented that end users may not receive security updates.

Each computer may perform differently.

For example some end users may have failure to update Microsoft Defender and others may have no problems.

I've got a computer that I had planned to use for a tutorial as it failed to upgrade.
It still continues to receive Microsoft Defender upgrades.

The Windows version is 1809 (OS Build 17763.1577)
The Microsoft Defender version is currently 1.359.59.0

On another computer Windows version is 21H1 (OS Build 19043.1526)
The Microsoft Defender version is currently 1.359.64.0

The Microsoft Defender versions are not identical but are very close for these different Windows version.

Lifecycle FAQ - Windows

Answers to frequently asked questions about the lifecycle policy for Windows products.

docs.microsoft.com

Windows 10 Home and Pro - Microsoft Lifecycle

Windows 10 Home and Pro follows the Modern Lifecycle Policy.

docs.microsoft.com

Also many end users use computers with up to date Windows 10 or Windows 11 with potentially reduced security as they have secure boot off.
Others may continue using BIOS Legacy and have no secure boot options.

Haydon · Feb 12, 2022

Dch48 said:
My old laptop is triple booting 98SE, XP, and 7. I can tell you for a fact that the free Avast antivirus still supports XP and 7. You can get the version for XP and it will still receive definition updates but not updates to the program itself. The version for 7 has everything.

There are also versions of Firefox and CCleaner for XP but they do not get updates.

That's reassuring

The issue will become imminent in October 2025 for one of my computers, a non-upgradable W10 which will still be quite usable. I will of course revisit the issue at that time, but here is hoping :)

K7MEM · Feb 12, 2022

Everyone seems to have old computers lying around. I still have, and use occasionally, a old laptop with Windows 3.1. It has a whopping 40 MB hard drive. I have the network adapter, but only connect it up for short periods, when necessary. It has MS Word, Excel, and Draw. I use it with a separate interface to my radio that can send/receive Morse Code, via a serial port. That program is written in C, compiled with Turbo-C ,and runs in DOS. But the battery is shot, and the charging circuit burned up. So it takes a few minutes to fire it up and never really knows what time it is. When I'm using it, it is never on the internet.

TairikuOkami · Feb 12, 2022

Surprisingly Windows gets more secure after EOL, because hackers loose interest in it and the new malware is not even compatible. For example I was running XP for a year without AV, firewall and using IE6 only and I did not get a single virus, because I simply disabled all vulnerable services and such. Basically all updates fix vulnerabilities in those processes and till they are released MS actually suggests disabling them as the workaround, just like it did with macros in the latest update, I do it since XP by disabling WSH, lol.

Microsoft's Small Step to Disable Macros Is a Huge Win for Security

Word and Excel files you download from the internet just got a whole lot safer.

www.wired.com

cereberus · Feb 12, 2022

TairikuOkami said:
Surprisingly Windows gets more secure after EOL, because hackers loose interest in it and the new malware is not even compatible. For example I was running XP for a year without AV, firewall and using IE6 only and I did not get a single virus, because I simply disabled all vulnerable services and such. Basically all updates fix vulnerabilities in those processes and till they are released MS actually suggests disabling them as the workaround, just like it did with macros in the latest update, I do it since XP by disabling WSH, lol.

Microsoft's Small Step to Disable Macros Is a Huge Win for Security

Word and Excel files you download from the internet just got a whole lot safer.

www.wired.com

Do you have proper evidence to support this?