Solved Are optical boot disks more reliable than USB boot sticks?

hsehestedt · Jan 13, 2022

jbcarreon123 said:
Is that 1000 Mebibytes? or 1000 Megabytes?
If the partition says not 1GB, use

Code:

cre par pri size=1024

It doesn't matter. We're not looking for a precise number, just something large enough to hold the needed files. It's a completely made up number. It could be 891 if that's large enough.

jimbo45 · Jan 14, 2022

hsehestedt said:
Just one word of caution on using an SSD as a Windows installation disk:

Some computers don't like to boot from NTFS formatted USB media which may cause you to create one or more FAT partitions on your SSD. Just be aware that FAT does not support TRIM.

Hi there
You create a small (one only) EFI partition formatted FAT32, size 100mb, 1 msr partition size 128 mb (not formatted) and for windows create vhdx files and use dism /Apply-Image to create Windows from the ISO image files. create the bootloader on the EFI partition with bcdboot. For Linux distros just create relevant partitions on the disk and the GRUB option will be added to the boot file automatically on the EFI partition. You need to ensure Primary partitions (GPT has no limit),. Similar for GPARTED (a stand alone partition manager).

Just create 1 standard NTFS primary partition for ALL the windows systems you want -- I vhdx file for each one in the same partition, and other partitions for other OS'es.

On my SSD I have W11 current release, W11 preview release, Windows PE, Windows server LTSC 2022 (trial) ,Arch Linux, Gparted, Macrium V8 stand alone recovery, W10 current release. That's 8 bootable choices.

Note on an external SSD you can't install new versions of Windows via UPDATE on a VHDX on a USB device but easy enough to do via HYPER-V. Standard updates work OK.

Cheers
jimbo

Dch48 · Jan 14, 2022

hsehestedt said:
@Dch48,

Apologies for the difficulties. I've run that on probably 100+ machines and never encountered anything like that. It's especially odd that simply partitioning a thumb drive would render it unseen to a USB port.

Let me do some investigation and see if I can get any clue into why that's happening.

Firstly, how large is the ISO image file that you mounted? I just want to be sure that it will fit on an 8GB flash drive. The batch file should detect if it won't but I just want to be sure up front.

In the meantime, if you want to try manually partitioning that thumb drive just to see if this happens outside of the batch file, I'd be curious as to what happens. If you don't want to risk it, I don't blame you :).

Here are the steps:

1) Run "diskpart"
2) In diskpart, run "list disk".
3) Note the drive number for the flash drive. I will assume disk 2 in the commands below, but be sure to replace "2" with the correct disk number. Also, I am assigning drive letters E and F. Use letters that are available on your system.
4) Run this series of commands:

select disk 2
clean
convert mbr
create partition primary size=1000
format fs=fat32 quick
assign letter=E
active
rescan
create partition primary
format fs=ntfs quick
assign letter=F
rescan
exit

At this point the flash drive should have 2 partitions. One just under 1GB in size, and another occupying all remaining space on the drive.

The ISO was a Windows 7 32 bit ISO that is only 2.2 GB in size. It's the only one I had handy. I have 2 optical drives in the computer lettered as E and F. The mounted ISO was I. The partitions created were G and H. When the batch started trying to copy the files it said that both partitions would be given the letter E (which was already in use ). Then it said it was unable to use the partitions because they weren't ready and the names could not be changed. After that, the drive was no longer seen in that USB port. In another port the drive showed as having the 2 partitions which were the right size and format with the letters G and H but both were empty. Do you have to use a Windows 11 ISO? I thought any Windows one would do. Maybe having the 2 optical drives messed it up?

Also, I have never seen any Windows installation media that had partitions. Why does the batch make them?

hsehestedt · Jan 14, 2022

Ahhh, that may be the difference. I only designed that batch file for Win 10 and 11. Never tested (and never will!) on Win 7.

It's meant to be run on Win 10 / 11 and to work with Win 10 / 11 ISO images only.

Dch48 · Jan 14, 2022

hsehestedt said:
Ahhh, that may be the difference. I only designed that batch file for Win 10 and 11. Never tested (and never will!) on Win 7.

It's meant to be run on Win 10 / 11 and to work with Win 10 / 11 ISO images only.

Okay, I'll try it with a Win 11 one and get back here with the results.

The computer is running 11.

Dch48 · Jan 14, 2022

No luck. The exact same thing happens. Here is what I get. The partitions created on the USB stick are H and I. Why does it say E for both of them? Once again the drive is now invisible on that port.

Dch48 · Jan 14, 2022

I just used that same Win11 ISO and same USB stick with Rufus and created an MBR boot media for either BIOS or UEFI. It boots perfectly and the drive only has the one partition which is NTFS. Why does your batch file create 2? I don't think it's necessary.

hsehestedt · Jan 14, 2022

Thanks for the update, Dch48.

The reason for having 2 partitions is for ultimate compatibility. Some systems will not boot from a flash drive formatted with NTFS, so we create a FAT32 partition. With FAT32, however, you cannot have files larger than 4GB. So, if you have an install.wim or install.esd over 4GB in size, it won't work with FAT32. To work around these issues, we boot from a FAT32 partition that has a minimal set of files on it, then the rest is stored on NTFS.

That method allows the flash drive to work on both BIOS and UEFI based systems, both x64 and x86 systems, and there is no problem with files over 4GB. Of course, with Win 11, x86 compatibility is no longer needed, but it still applies to Win 10.

So, here is what I think is happening: My routine that detects the next available drive letter is failing on your system for some reason. There must be something out of the ordinary on your system that my detection is not handling correctly. I think that for now, what I will do is remove that and simply ask the user to provide drive letters. It may be this evening before I have time to do that. If you wouldn't mind trying it again then I would appreciate it.

Thanks so much for pointing this out. I really hate when I run into weird issues like this where it works on so many systems but then something you didn't think of bites you in the backside.

hsehestedt · Jan 14, 2022

Dch48,

I've edited my post and placed updated code in that post. The batch file will no longer try to automatically assign drive letters, it will ask the user for drive letters to assign to the flash drive.

I'd love to know if this fixes the issue for you.

Dch48 · Jan 14, 2022

Okay, the new file works and the stick boots. Success. The drive also is visible in the port it was created in.

hsehestedt · Jan 14, 2022

Dch48,

Thanks for testing that for me. Really appreciate it.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with using tools like Rufus, etc. I'm just one of those people who like to do as much as possible without third-party utilities. I knew the series of steps to take manually to make this work, but just wanted to automate it with a batch file.

glasskuter · Jan 19, 2022

hsehestedt said:
if you were willing to try a batch file that I have to see if it can make those drives bootable.

Sorry I'm just getting around to testing your batch file. Using it I was able to get a PNY drive bootable that would not boot before despite my multiple attempts using Rufus. I had another cheapo no-name drive that it did not work on, but it's probably a defective drive. Good job on the batch file.

hsehestedt · Jan 19, 2022

Fantastic! Thanks for taking the time to try that out. I'm especially happy that it was able to help with that drive.

fmw · Jan 23, 2022

In the same way an SSD is more reliable than a hard disk drive, so a flash drive is more reliable than an optical disk. The media without anything mechanical will win every time.