KB5005191 Windows 11 Insider Preview Dev and Beta Build 10.0.22000.168 - August 27

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

swarfega said:
Microsoft have been asking people to change to Beta.

They have and I think twice so far.. my plan is to wait a few months and see how the dev channel goes.. then I'll go to the RTM version.

sgage · Sep 1, 2021

Winuser said:
Are you sure you are in the Dev Channel and not the Beta Channel? For now MS is supposed to be relaxing the requirements for the Windows 11 Dev Channel.

I have been in the Dev Channel since the beginning. I have Secure Boot, and TPM 2.0, but a non-compliant CPU (i5-7400). I haven't been kicked off (yet), but on the Insiders page of Settings, I get the warning about "there might be some issues and bugs". I am unable to down-level to Beta - there is simply no option for changing levels, which I assume is due to having a non-qualifying machine.

There is an option to 'Stop getting Preview Builds'. The option to stop getting new builds when Windows 11 is released is greyed out. The only other option is to stop now, by clean installing Win10.

My understanding was that non-compliant Dev branch people would continue to receive new builds, including new post-release builds, but we wouldn't be able to hop off at the release the way you could with Win10 (presumably compliant machines do NOT have that option greyed out).

So I guess I'm still waiting to be thrown out of Insiders on this machine. It might be interesting if people posting about this would a) double check what branch they're in, and b) list what degree of compliance they have (SB, TPM, CPU).

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

sgage said:
I have been in the Dev Channel since the beginning. I have Secure Boot, and TPM 2.0, but a non-compliant CPU (i5-7400). I haven't been kicked off (yet), but on the Insiders page of Settings, I get the warning about "there might be some issues and bugs". I am unable to down-level to Beta - there is simply no option for changing levels, which I assume is due to having a non-qualifying machine.

There is an option to 'Stop getting Preview Builds'. The option to stop getting new builds when Windows 11 is released is greyed out. The only other option is to stop now, by clean installing Win10.

My understanding was that non-compliant Dev branch people would continue to receive new builds, including new post-release builds, but we wouldn't be able to hop off at the release the way you could with Win10 (presumably compliant machines do NOT have that option greyed out).

So I guess I'm still waiting to be thrown out of Insiders on this machine. It might be interesting if people posting about this would a) double check what branch they're in, and b) list what degree of compliance they have (SB, TPM, CPU).

I never read where MS said the non compliant PC's would continue to get updates. I also assumed that non compliant PC's would be getting updates but that was a guess. It seems MS has finalized it's decision and we know how they'll handle non compliant PC's from now on

sgage · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
I never read where MS said the non compliant PC's would continue to get updates. I also assumed that non compliant PC's would be getting updates but that was a guess. It seems MS has finalized it's decision and we know how they'll handle non compliant PC's from now on

I thought I read something a couple-three weeks ago to that effect. Not that I want to get preview builds past the release.

Next question: What about clean installations from an ISO (made before general release), that are not in the Insiders Program?

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

sgage said:
I thought I read something a couple-three weeks ago to that effect. Not that I want to get preview builds past the release.

Next question: What about clean installations from an ISO (made before general release), that are not in the Insiders Program?

It wouldn't make sense to have non complaint systems in the insider program. MS needs to have testing done on compliant systems so the don't get errors that aren't diretly related to the OS but could be due to the hardware specs.

I think you still can do a clean instillation of 11 but I doubt you'll get any updates including security patches. Non compliant systems will not get support by MS and using it would be a risk the user has to accept.

clam1952 · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
It wouldn't make sense to have non complaint systems in the insider program. MS needs to have testing done on compliant systems so the don't get errors that aren't diretly related to the OS but could be due to the hardware specs.

I think you still can do a clean instillation of 11 but I doubt you'll get any updates including security patches. Non compliant systems will not get support by MS and using it would be a risk the user has to accept.

One question is, assuming that it is still possible to install from an ISO on unsupported Hardware, would those with Installs on "banned" hardware be able to download the updates manually?
Theoretically it should be possible?

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

clam1952 said:
One question is, assuming that it is still possible to install from an ISO on unsupported Hardware, would those with Installs on "banned" hardware be able to download the updates manually?
Theoretically it should be possible?

Well.. I don't know but I would think that a clean instillation would be rejected due to non compliant hardware. There would be no point in letting users install 11 only to not support it later on. On the 5th of Oct we'll see how things go when people install 11 on non compliant PC's,, and they will.

J

sgage · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
Well.. I don't know but I would think that a clean instillation would be rejected due to non compliant hardware. There would be no point in letting users install 11 only to not support it later on. On the 5th of Oct we'll see how things go when people install 11 on non compliant PC's,, and they will.

J

MS has already clearly stated that people would be able to do clean installs on non-compliant hardware.

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

sgage said:
MS has already clearly stated that people would be able to do clean installs on non-compliant hardware.

And they said they would get updates. Kind of silly letting people install an OS that will not get support

magilla · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
And they said they would get updates. Kind of silly letting people install an OS that will not get support

Seems to me they have issued multiple conflicting statements. Very discouraging. Don’t know anything about Linux but sounding more and more like a possibility.

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

magilla said:
Seems to me they have issued multiple conflicting statements. Very discouraging. Don’t know anything about Linux but sounding more and more like a possibility.

I tried Linux and I passed. I just never loved it enough to stick with it. To me the bottom line is if your hardware is compliant you can use 11 otherwise you'll get to use 10 for at least 4 more years.

clam1952 · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
And they said they would get updates. Kind of silly letting people install an OS that will not get support

But, they also allegedly said they won't get updates, lot of confusion being created by certain sites with unverifiable statements supposedly from Microsoft, which I doubt. Unless it comes from a Microsoft site or blog it's probably speculative BS.

Reldel · Sep 1, 2021

sgage said:
MS has already clearly stated that people would be able to do clean installs on non-compliant hardware.

I have the Beta installed on a Lenovo Yoga 710, but I presume, because the processor is not on the approved list, I cannot download the Beta ISO.

magilla · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
I tried Linux and I passed. I just never loved it enough to stick with it. To me the bottom line is if your hardware is compliant you can use 11 otherwise you'll get to use 10 for at least 4 more years.

Well, I thought I had a few more weeks on win 11 before d-day. Have been waiting to buy new systems until close to October. Now, none of my systems comply since Ryzen 1st gen are not allowed. Oh, well.

BunnyJ · Sep 1, 2021

magilla said:
Well, I thought I had a few more weeks on win 11 before d-day. Have been waiting to buy new systems until close to October. Now, none of my systems comply since Ryzen 1st gen are not allowed. Oh, well.

I had the same issue with a first gen Ryzen but I got a 2nd gen so that's no longer an issue. But I understand how frustrating it is to have a decent processor and not be complaint
.

clam1952 · Sep 1, 2021

magilla said:
Well, I thought I had a few more weeks on win 11 before d-day. Have been waiting to buy new systems until close to October. Now, none of my systems comply since Ryzen 1st gen are not allowed. Oh, well.

Could just upgrade the CPU an X370 pro will take the 3xxx series processors, just had a look at the CPU support for the X370 Pro, may need just a bios update if not up to date, I swapped my first gen Ryzen for a Ryzen 7 3800X, different mother board, ASUS Prime B350 Plus but it works very well and didn't need to update the bios a lot cheaper than buying a new rig.

magilla · Sep 1, 2021

clam1952 said:
Could just upgrade the CPU an X370 pro will take the 3xxx series processors, just had a look at the CPU support for the X370 Pro, may need just a bios update if not up to date, I swapped my first gen Ryzen for a Ryzen 7 3800X, different mother board, ASUS Prime B350 Plus but it works very well and didn't need to update the bios a lot cheaper than buying a new rig.

Yes, I am concerned about the liquid cooling system on the CPU. I have had one cooling system leak and fry a mobo. So, I may see what some of my friends have to say about removing and replacing the cooling system on a new CPU. Just hate to do that and fry the mobo and still have to buy a new system on top of that! Glad you were able to do that change without incident. BTW my bios is up to date.

sgage · Sep 1, 2021

BunnyJ said:
And they said they would get updates. Kind of silly letting people install an OS that will not get support

They said they would not get updates. Or, rather, it was reported that they would not get updates. In any case, I have deleted my Insiders Win11 install. I may or may not try a clean install from iso down the line. I have wasted enough time on this already.

bobkn · Sep 1, 2021

sgage said:
They said they would not get updates. Or, rather, it was reported that they would not get updates. In any case, I have deleted my Insiders Win11 install. I may or may not try a clean install from iso down the line. I have wasted enough time on this already.

5 weeks to go. I wonder how long after 5 October it'll take to establish the facts?

I'd be more frustrated myself if my desktop PCs weren't on the fully supported list.

sgage · Sep 1, 2021

bobkn said:
5 weeks to go. I wonder how long after 5 October it'll take to establish the facts?

I'd be more frustrated myself if my desktop PCs weren't on the fully supported list.

I imagine just a week later - Patch Tuesday. Clean install people will either get the CU, or not, and then we'll know. Why MS can't issue a clear and simple statement of how it's really going to be, instead of letting outfits like the Verge spew rumors, is beyond me. But MS is the worst communicator in the history of the modern corporation.