Sleep Option has Disappeared from Everywhere

Try3 · May 18, 2024

pacificSurf said:
I thought the point of Network Connectivity in Modern Standby is to run tasks in background

No, Network connectivity merely means that it stays connected to the network when it is in S0 Modern standby.
Windows can run some favoured apps in the background during S0 Modern standby. There is no list of them but the built-in mail app & Windows update are thought to be included.
So being connected to the network does allow those apps to do something but it is not what Network connectivity itself means.
Those favoured apps would run / continue running even if there was no Network connectivity but would not be able to achieve anything.

pacificSurf said:
So you can not use Task Scheduler when in Modern Standby S0. (Sleep in my start menu triggers Modern Standby S0)

The display going off triggers S0 Modern standby. So yes, Start, Power, Sleep or Power options, Sleep after ... turn off the display so they do trigger S0 Modern standby.
You cannot run your own scheduled tasks if you use Start, Power, Sleep or Power options, Sleep after ...
Start, Power, Sleep or Power options, Sleep after ... send S0 Modern standby into a later phase that does not allow Task scheduler to run user tasks.
Avoiding those two keeps S0 Modern standby in an earlier phase that allows Task scheduler to run user tasks.
The existence of S0 Modern standby phases is mentioned in Modern standby - Key concepts overview - MSLearn & some of the other documents listed in S0 Modern standby references list - my post #8 - TenForums but I regard the important point as being whether or not Task scheduler can run user tasks.

pacificSurf said:
So Enabling or disabling Network connectivity does not affect you from running scripts when in Modern Standby S0.
But you still can't use Task Scheduler.

During S0 Modern standby, there is no user interface with which to run tasks. Task scheduler is the only available method of running them.
Network connectivity has no effect on the situation.

pacificSurf said:
So even though its called "Sleep" in the menu, its not sleep. It's Modern Standby S0 being labeled as Sleep.

Correct.
Both ought to be labelled S0 Modern standby later phase.

Denis

hdmi · May 18, 2024

Try3 said:
Both ought to be labelled S0 Modern standby later phase.

"Broken Sleep" would be more accurate. lol

pacificSurf · May 18, 2024

Okay, Interesting. I think Im getting it a bit more now.

Try3 said:
You cannot run your own scheduled tasks if you use Start, Power, Sleep or Power options, Sleep after ...
Start, Power, Sleep or Power options, Sleep after ... send S0 Modern standby into a later phase that does not allow Task scheduler to run user tasks.
Avoiding those two keeps S0 Modern standby in an earlier phase that allows Task scheduler to run user tasks.

"If you use Start, Power, Sleep,... it sends S0 Modern standby into a later phase"

How does one use the "Sleep" button while keeping Modern Standby in the earlier phase and not the later phase? You can't?
So were really just talking about letting the display turn off\timeout, and the whole system is still on, fans running, etc, (except the display?)

"Windows can run some favoured apps in the background during S0 Modern standby."

And I assume Windows can also do that in the later phase of Modern Standby? (I.e., after pressing the sleep button)

dacrone · May 18, 2024

If you run the command I posted on the first page, does it not still sleep?

Fabler2 · May 18, 2024

dacrone said:
If you run the command I posted on the first page, does it not still sleep?

Just for info with Modern Standby turned off that command does nothing as sleep isn't available on such devices.

pacificSurf · May 18, 2024

hdmi said:
S0ix came to existence many years before Modern Standby did. Modern Standby was introduced by Microsoft with the release of Windows 10. It is a continuation of Connected Standby, and, the latter was introduced with the release of Windows 8. However, S0ix are power states of the SoC (System-on-a-Chip) so then we are talking about those specific hardware components that are inside the SoC.

Intel's Haswell Architecture Analyzed: Building a New PC and a New Intel

www.anandtech.com

Hardware components, or devices that are outside the SoC also have various different power states, the D0 power state being the "fully on" device power state. Within the D0 state, such devices can have various device-specific F states the goal of which is to let a system dynamically manage the power efficiency of each device that is fully on. By contrast, D2 and D3 are (also device-specific) low-power states that can potentially also be defined. But Windows 8 onwards, the D3 state can potentially be subdivided into D3hot and D3cold.

Device Power States - Windows drivers

Device Power States

learn.microsoft.com

Device Low-Power States - Windows drivers

Device Low-Power States

learn.microsoft.com

An important thing to note here is that, to save enough power, devices that are outside the SoC need to be put in a low-power device state before the SoC can enter S0ix.

Prepare hardware for modern standby

On entry to standby, hardware components must be prepared to make the transition to low-power operation.

learn.microsoft.com

My gosh, so many variables and levels.
Seems like D3hot or D3cold is the most ideal state, closest to the original concept of "sleep" But even that "may" still have the ability to self-wake according to that MS article you linked. A lot of it is over my head though.

"By contrast, D2 and D3 are .... can potentially also be defined"
...Do you mean, I could try defining/programming a D3hot only version of Modern Standby to be enabled, when I press "sleep"?
Even if so, seems Messing with Modern Standby risks a lot of problems, as Try3 encountered.

dacrone · May 18, 2024

Sorry must’ve misunderstood. So you have:

Hibernate OFF
Fast Startup OFF
Modern Standby S0 ON
Modern Standby S3 Unavailable

Is that correct?

pacificSurf · May 18, 2024

dacrone said:
Sorry must’ve misunderstood. So you have:

Hibernate OFF
Fast Startup OFF
Modern Standby S0 ON
Modern Standby S3 Unavailable

Is that correct?

I had tried your command in 3 scenarios with nothing happening. I believe Fast Startup is auto disabled when Hibernate is disabled? See CMD results attached. Fast Start up also disappears from power options when hibernate is disabled.

Hibernate ON + Modern Standby S0 OFF
Modern Standby S3 - The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Hibernate OFF + Modern Standby S0 ON
Modern Standby S3 - The system firmware does not support this standby state.

Hibernate OFF + Modern Standby S0 OFF
Modern Standby S3 - The system firmware does not support this standby state.

dacrone · May 18, 2024

some more research on that model seems to indicate that it was a bios update that removed the force s3 from the coding. *according to user replies* - you won't be able to undo that. but you can enable modern standby, disable hibernation and run the following two tweaks from the below linked reddit post (yes, i know its Dell related):

Will prevent for example bluetooth mice to wake up the laptop, even with lid closed on battery:

reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Power /v EnableInputSuppression /t REG_DWORD /d 1

Will always disable wlan/lan when switching to modern standby:

reg add HKLM\System\CurrentControlSet\Control\Power /v EnforceDisconnectedStandby /t REG_DWORD /d 1

https://www.reddit.com/r/Dell/comments/h0r56s/getting_back_s3_sleep_and_disabling_modern

If you want to create a custom shortcut to launch modern standby, you can use PsShutdown with the -x switch:

PsShutdown - Sysinternals

Shuts down and optionally reboots a computer.

learn.microsoft.com

Try3 · May 19, 2024

pacificSurf said:
How does one use the "Sleep" button while keeping Modern Standby in the earlier phase and not the later phase? You can't?

You can't.

pacificSurf said:
So were really just talking about letting the display turn off\timeout, and the whole system is still on, fans running, etc, (except the display?)

The fans will run if the temperature & any cooling policy demand that they run.
It is not merely that the display is off. Everything is sent into a low power state.

pacificSurf said:
And I assume Windows can also do that in the later phase of Modern Standby? (I.e., after pressing the sleep button)

I've never tested that. I think so - that MS's favoured apps & processes can still run.

dacrone said:
Modern Standby S3 Unavailable

There's no such term.
S3 Sleep is unavailable.
S3 Sleep is what we all casually refer to as sleep.

pacificSurf said:
I believe Fast Startup is auto disabled when Hibernate is disabled?

I don't think so.
You can check in Power options, Choose what the power buttons do.

dacrone said:
Will always disable wlan/lan when switching to modern standby

I would use the forum tutorial on the subject. Forum tutorials contain explanations and benefit from being updated when new information comes to light & user experiences are reported.
Enable or disable Modern Standby connectivity in Windows 10 and Windows 11 - ElevenForumTutorials

dacrone said:
If you want to create a custom shortcut to launch modern standby

If you want to launch S0 Modern standby, you can take any action that turns off your display.
I have NirSoft's NirCmd so my display-off shortcut [that initiates S0 Modern standby] is
C:\Tools\External\NirSoft\NirCmd\x64\NirCmd.exe monitor off
I stick all scripts & portable utilities within subfolders of C:\Tools, the folder I created for this purpose. I posted an explanation and some guidance in
Set up my Tools folder ditty - TenForums

All the best,
Denis

hdmi · May 19, 2024

pacificSurf said:
My gosh, so many variables and levels.

Troubleshooting S3 can also be a PITA sometimes, though. But yeah, the fact that the added complexities that are inherent of Modern Standby can very often tend to create real nightmares behooves no further explanation IMO.

pacificSurf said:
Seems like D3hot or D3cold is the most ideal state, closest to the original concept of "sleep" But even that "may" still have the ability to self-wake according to that MS article you linked. A lot of it is over my head though.

Assuming that it behaves how the user wants it to behave, the ability to self-wake can be a good thing. But when the laptop wakes up by itself so it drains the battery overnight or gets scaldingly hot inside a laptop bag or backpack, that's when trouble starts. When the laptop randomly wakes up after you gave it no consent to do so in any way whatsoever, that's when trouble starts. When the laptop falls asleep and you only wanted to keep the screen off letting your task continue to run so it is still running after 5 minutes on battery, that's when trouble starts. This reminds me of automatic reboots after receiving an update. You launch a task only to later find out that Windows rebooted by itself which interrupted the task. Next, Microsoft invented Active Hours. Now, Windows interrupts the task by forcing Modern Standby when you turn the screen off. I wonder what will be next. Screen Minutes? Personally, I, consider myself lucky that a lot of this is over my head, as I certainly do not envy those who "understand" this whole modern type of (dis)functional design...

pacificSurf said:
"By contrast, D2 and D3 are .... can potentially also be defined"
...Do you mean, I could try defining/programming a D3hot only version of Modern Standby to be enabled, when I press "sleep"?
Even if so, seems Messing with Modern Standby risks a lot of problems, as Try3 encountered.

No, for each device only the manufacturer of the device can decide which low-power states are defined and which ones are not defined. Similarly, D3cold capabilities of a device can also be defined only by the manufacturer of the device, but, also similarly, the manufacturer is also not obligated to define them.

hdmi · May 19, 2024

Here's a batch script that compiles a file ScreenOff.exe with an icon embedded in it. (Just extract the icon from the zipfile below to the same folder as the batchfile, and run the batchfile.) When you run the .exe it waits for 2 seconds before it turns the screen off so that any mouse movement that might result from letting go of the mouse right after you use the mouse to run the .exe will not cause the screen to turn back on.

Batch:

// 2>NUL&@ECHO OFF&CLS&GOTO batch
/*
:batch
FOR /F "tokens=* USEBACKQ" %%F IN (`REG QUERY "HKLM\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\NET Framework Setup\NDP\v4\Full" /v InstallPath`) DO SET "InstallPath=%%F"
SET InstallPath=%InstallPath:*REG_SZ =%
FOR /F "tokens=* Eol= " %%F IN ("%InstallPath%") DO SET "InstallPath=%%F"
IF EXIST "%InstallPath%csc.exe" ("%InstallPath%csc.exe" /out:"%~dp0\ScreenOff.exe" /target:winexe /win32icon:"Sleep.ico" "%~dpnx0") ELSE (ECHO ERROR - Missing csc.exe)
PAUSE&EXIT
*/

using System;
using System.Windows.Forms;
using System.Runtime.InteropServices;
using System.Threading;

static class Program
{
    [DllImport("user32.dll")]
    static extern IntPtr SendMessage(IntPtr hWnd, uint Msg, int wParam, int lParam);

    [STAThread]
    static void Main()
    {
        Thread.Sleep(2000);
        SendMessage(new Form().Handle, 0x0112, 0xF170, 2);
    }
}