Solved Start menu superposed by suggested


Judiver

Judiver
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Hi forum,

Since a couple of days, I have the following thing happening.

Whenever I click the Start button I get my own Start menu, but when I want to write something in the search box Windows superposes it with another start menu with "Suggestions", "Quick searches" and "Top apps".

Start-up.jpg

Yesterday I got some French stuff written in the origianal search box "Journée de l'abeille" (day of the bees) or something similar. Starting to type the program I was looking for gave me this 2nd screen with the right side filled with pictures of bees. I was in the middle of something that I'm trying to fix (when I have time) since a couple of months now (and I don't think there's a solution as HP intentionally bricked my printer - again - with an update insiduously released under the banner "to improve security" || updates again, I hate them, always problems...) and it sooo annoying when your computer all of a sudden decides you need to look at THEIR stuff, use their favorite programs (like Edge). I don't want to know about bees when I'm in the middle of some complicated stuff. I'll decide for myself when or if I want to know about bees. And I am annoyed I get stuff in French whereas my whole pc is in English. I don't want THEIR start menu which contains nothing I need/use, I want mine (back off Windows, I have other things to do!!!). I got rid of the bees by deselecting suggestions (I think it was) at the bottom of this start menu, but still get the superposed start menu when I try to type something in the original search box, so not own start menu with my pinned programs.

I already had put all options I could find that change my Start menu to "off" (show most recent apps etc.) as I just want something static (list or pics), so whenever I open Start things are always at the same place and I know where to find them in a sec.

Does anyone know how can I stop Windows overwriting my own Start menu?
Thank you in advance.
 

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Judiver

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As I've been trying to find a solution to make my printer work again, I've been visiting lots of pages, downloading, trying to install/update printer firmware etc. So, a check of my computer couldn't hurt, even though this appears to be a Windows thing in my eyes (but one can be fooled). Results:

Malwarebytes scan 0 threads

For different virus scan I needed to close my browser. It found no threats but deleted junk/left overs/cookies etc.
So I closed Firefox (which is my default, and only browser I had open). But Edge Chromium needed to be closed as well... It didn't show up as open anywhere. That is really strange. Moreover, there was 227Mb in cache (whereas I never use it...), which I deleted.

When checking files that have been updated/installed in the last couple of days I saw:
- Programs: Edge update 20 Aug
- In my user account's favorites: Bing (and Acer) 20 Aug
I never ever use Edge or Bing and blocked/deselected Edge wherever possible and deleted Bing from browser options. My favorites folder should be empty, so I emptied it.

After these checks/deletions, I still get this strange startup menu that equals Search. If I click Search the magnifying glass gets the "Edge" colours (blue/green). I don't know if that's normal as I never use Search (but do have it on my taskbar).

In all, so far, my first check points to the Edge update of yesterday.
Does anyone have a similar experience with a strange Start Menu?
 

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glasskuter

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I don't want THEIR start menu which contains nothing I need/use, I want mine (back off Windows, I have other things to do!!!)
I do not know why your start menu is superimposed. Have you restarted to see if it goes back to normal? There is a possibility a windows update broke it. Also, (I'm not pointing fingers here, just making an observation so please do not take offense) from reading your other posts, you tend to delete and attempt to change things you do not like about 11 to get rid of all MS changes so there's a possibility it occurred because of that.

First I would suggest you make sure you have no corrupt system files that is causing this problem. Open a command prompt as administrator and type sfc /scannow
Pay attention to the scan results to see if SFC found anything it could not repair. If it found corruption it could not fix followup with this command (note the spaces)
dism /online /cleanup-image /restorehealth
Restart computer

Many here who do not like the new start menu use third party apps that make the new start menu appear more like Windows 10 or even Windows 7. There are many out there, some paid, some free. The most highly recommended ones are Explorerpatcher (free) StartAllBack ($4.99) OpenShell (free) Start 11 ($5.99)

You have to remember when using any start menu replacement app that sometimes Microsoft will make changes in an update which breaks them but usually the developer of these apps is on top of it and immediately releases an update to the app. I suggest you look into using one of them. Each has screenshots and descriptions on their web site.
 
Last edited:

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Judiver

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Hi Glasskuter,

Thanks for your reaction.

I had restarted my computer right after my 2nd message, but there was no change.

Apart from emptying the Favorites folder in my user account, I haven't deleted anything that I didn't put on my computer myself. I think Bing ended up there as an unwanted extra (Bing-bar, which I didn't install) with a program I downloaded.

I have not installed an app to get a different Start Menu. I didn't like the W10 one, so why go back to that. The only thing I did in the Start Menu (but that was long ago when I installed W11 - and redid it when creating a new user account) was pinning the apps I use and deselecting all I could (suggestions/updating with recently used apps etc.). Only "legitimate" Windows possibilities and options, nothing else. Haven't touched/changed the Start Menu since.

Windows didn't update. After the last update I postponed updates for as long as I could. They are still paused until Sept 10. But Edge got updated yesterday (without me asking/notifying/knowing), and if I'm not mistaken the first time I saw this strange Start Menu, which really is loaded on top of, or better yet, replacing, the normal one, was yesterday.

I will run a scannow tonight, as that will take time. But if something got broken, where do these bees come from??? That French text and those pics of bees, I can hardly imagine they got created by an update that didn't go well. It is really weird.

And yes, I do like to have my pc my way and not being forced upon, or tracked, stuff installed/rearranged/changed unknowingly, get English results when I search in French (or vice versa) etc. I get irritated when some program seems to know what I like/want and kick it back to its place. I'll accept what's mandatory or necessary (so I expect Windows to set the limits and warn me if I'm tempting to do something I shouldn't do), but the rest is up to me.
 

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Judiver

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I did the sfc /scannow but it found no integrity violations or corrupt files.
I did a restart after scan (and before), but problem is still there.
 

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glasskuter

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When I click my start menu, it shows only my pinned apps,all apps, and a recommended section that has nothing in it because I have that option turned off in group policy. That is what I expect to see since I have recently added, most used, and recently opened turned off in settings>personalization>start. However, when I click search icon, my start menu pops up showing the search bar, suggested, quick searches and top apps, just like yours (even though I have top apps turned off in start menu.) It seems windows treats the start menu differently when you click on search which I rarely do.

So That big white box you are seeing is not an overlay. It's the space where you would see your most used apps. Try going to your settings -personalization-start and turn on most used apps. Also check that this setting is on. Settings > Privacy & security > General and turn on the “Let Windows improve Start and search results by tracking app launches” option.Then use a few apps and see if that area doesn't populate with the apps you used. You may have to use the apps a few times before it will populate.
 
Last edited:

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Edwin

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When you click on the Start orb, just start typing..., don't give that Type here to search dialog box mouse focus!

Just start typing right away and you won't see those suggestions.
 

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glasskuter

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click on the Start orb, just start typing
Well, you taught me something. I search so seldom I never learned that. I always wondered why search wasn't on start . TY
 

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Judiver

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Hi Erwin and Glasskuter,

Thank you for your reactions.

First of all, I think my image was a bit misleading. Because I didn't think the apps were relevant, I had blanked them out. They do appear. Sorry.

I don't want Windows to improve my Start. You find things a lot quicker if they stay in the same spot, even if you have to scroll down (because these icons take up so much space). Even before you click, your eye already knows where to look.

I had set up another user account when I created this one (should ever there be a problem) to which I logged in for the first time this morning. I wanted to see what happens without all my personalizations. I appears with owls in the "Type here to search" section. Starting to type there overlaid my Start menu with the Search screen with pics of owls and terriers etc (showing MS Bing logo on the big image, text in French).

So it looks just like what I had on my screen on my usual user account yesterday. I never had that before because I had turned off suggestions in my normal user account even before knowing what it was going to give me. I think there just must have been a glitch somewhere that reinstalled the suggestions (?). Perhaps (who knows...) because I was working on getting my printer to work again, looking for older HP firmware and that firmware always comes with the option to install Bing (which I didn't, but maybe some obscure download did something anyway). So it looks to me that what I saw yesterday is W11 Start Menu without personalization, to which I was not at all accustomed.

Yes, there are several search possibilities. One where you just start to type on the orb (and it gives you web results, on Bing, among other things). Another where you type in the box and it gives you the same results as the search by magnifying glass (so in my eyes this is double/superfluous): things/apps on your computer. And there's rightclicking the start button which gives a condensed list that for once doesn't take up half your screen. But rightclicking Start is actually partly overlapping Settings. I find it unclear, confusing, cluttered: too many "entrances" and differently looking menus. Not standardized or hierarchical, so lacking structure to easily find what you're looking for. I hardly ever use any of it, I have my necessary icons on my desktop (although it is not that easy any more to send a shortcut there) and taskbar. Also because Windows intentionnally leaves out most non-MS apps such as Firefox, gmail, Google maps and lots of others I use on Search, and I can't pin some stuff on Start. That feels like a dictatorial state where things are banned and silenced. It's not neutral and doesn't reflect what I use on a daily basis.
 

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ShamrockRig

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When you click on the Start orb, just start typing..., don't give that Type here to search dialog box mouse focus!

Just start typing right away and you won't see those suggestions.
Agreed, Didn't know that this wasn't what people done lol, Think i've clicked on it about 2 times in over a year
 

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glasskuter

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    DELL 0J37VM
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    Windows 10 Pro 21H2
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    Dell Optiplex 9020
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    i7-4770
    Memory
    24 gb
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    256 gb Toshiba BG4 M.2 NVE SSB and 1 tb hdd
    PSU
    500w
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Judiver

Judiver
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Thank you Glasskuter.
In fact to search the web I use my browser, but it's good that Bing is gone here. Hopefully I won't come back with suggestions in another glitch. Chances are I get irritated again ;-).
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Acer Aspire 5 A517
    CPU
    i7-8550U @1.80GHz 1.99GHz
    Memory
    8GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    NVIDIA GeForce MX150
    Sound Card
    Realtek HIgh Definition Audio (SST)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17.3" IPS
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080 (Full HD)
    Hard Drives
    SSD 256GB
    5400rpm HDD
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    qwerty

glasskuter

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Chances are I get irritated again
I used to. Now I close my eyes and hum like a Tibetan monk. It took me a long time to realize getting pi$$ed off wasn't changing anything and was only playing havoc with my blood pressure. Now, I do my best to roll with the flow...most of the time. :rolleyes:
 

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    i9-10900 10 core 20 threads
    Motherboard
    DELL 0J37VM
    Memory
    32 gb
    Graphics Card(s)
    none-Intel UHD Graphics 630
    Sound Card
    Integrated Realtek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    256 m.2 2230-256+1 tb hdd
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell Premium
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Internet Speed
    so slow I'm too embarrassed to tell
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro 21H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 9020
    CPU
    i7-4770
    Memory
    24 gb
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    256 gb Toshiba BG4 M.2 NVE SSB and 1 tb hdd
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell factory
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
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    still not telling
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Edwin

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I search the web with Chrome...,
I search my PC with shell:::{9343812e-1c37-4a49-a12e-4b2d810d956b}
 

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    ASUS VivoBook

BruceR

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Yesterday I got some French stuff written in the origianal search box "Journée de l'abeille" (day of the bees) or something similar. Starting to type the program I was looking for gave me this 2nd screen with the right side filled with pictures of bees.

It appears with owls in the "Type here to search" section. Starting to type there overlaid my Start menu with the Search screen with pics of owls and terriers etc

Turn off Show search highlights at Settings, Privacy & security, Search permissions:

Enable or Disable Search Highlights in Windows 11
 

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Judiver

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Hi everyone, thank you all for all your reactions.
I'm sorry I haven't responded earlier, I was in the middle of this printer mess. Won 1 little battle (I actually got into what has become a "Fort Knox"), but lost 3. But hey, you usually make things worse before you're able to make 'm better, if at all.

Edwin, I installed that shell. I've been doing my searches in a similar way: File Explorer, select C:\ and type in the search box. But the shell is 1 step quicker, I don't have to go to C:\. Thanks for the tip, I'll leave the icon on my desktop.

BruceR, all options were off, all search permissions (SafeSearch, Cloud, History, More Settings...). And in settings, personalization, start all is/was off too (recently added apps, most used apps, items in start/jump lists/FE, and all options in folders). All tracking/location off. Everything off. But somewhere a glitch (when I tried to get my printer to work again) must have put the suggestions back on (at least, that's my best guess) and I had never seen such content before because when I installed W11 I put off all options straight on off. A computer is a tool. I like to work with it, not on it (sorry you experts ;-)), and I don't like it to be dynamic, changing all the time and starting to think for itself.

Too bad if I opt out of using interesting/useful features, but I don't like the idea of Big Brother is watching me either. We are living in an over-connected world in which you have to protect yourself against intrusions (if only to keep concentrated on what you're doing) and "theft" of data. I've become not to trust manufacturers any longer. They have found new ways to make money out of their customers, with murky if not illegitimate practices and crooky business models. I do like your image of the Tibetan monk, Glasskuter. At least no one tampers with his Chak-pur when he puts it down before going to sleep and picks it up again the next morning. The bell still spins with the same sound as ever... and when he speaks Lhasa Tibetan to his fellow monks, they answer him in the same language. He can be at peace because he doesn't have a computer... or an HP printer. He's only connected to himself and only the big snowy mountain peaks hear his hum ;-).
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Acer Aspire 5 A517
    CPU
    i7-8550U @1.80GHz 1.99GHz
    Memory
    8GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    NVIDIA GeForce MX150
    Sound Card
    Realtek HIgh Definition Audio (SST)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17.3" IPS
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080 (Full HD)
    Hard Drives
    SSD 256GB
    5400rpm HDD
    Keyboard
    qwerty

Judiver

Judiver
Thread Starter
Local time
10:11 AM
Posts
31
Location
France
OS
Windows11
Or caused by the update of Edge, which happened (without notification) on the same day these suggestions were turned on all of a sudden. Coincidence or cause...?
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Acer Aspire 5 A517
    CPU
    i7-8550U @1.80GHz 1.99GHz
    Memory
    8GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    NVIDIA GeForce MX150
    Sound Card
    Realtek HIgh Definition Audio (SST)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17.3" IPS
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080 (Full HD)
    Hard Drives
    SSD 256GB
    5400rpm HDD
    Keyboard
    qwerty

Brink

Administrator
Staff member
MVP
Local time
3:11 AM
Posts
6,547
OS
Windows 11 Pro for Workstations
Just to note that what you are seeing is Windows Search (Win+S) instead of the Start menu. As soon as you click in/on the search box on the Start menu, it becomes Windows Search instead.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro for Workstations
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Custom self build
    CPU
    Intel i7-8700K 5 GHz
    Motherboard
    ASUS ROG Maximus XI Formula Z390
    Memory
    16 GB (8GBx2) G.SKILL TridentZ DDR4 3200 MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    ASUS ROG-STRIX-GTX1080TI-O11G-GAMING
    Sound Card
    Integrated Digital Audio (S/PDIF)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    2 x Samsung Odyssey G75 27"
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    1TB Samsung 980 PRO M.2,
    1TB Samsung 970 EVO Plus M.2,
    6TB WD Black WD6001FZWX
    8TB WD MyCloudEX2Ultra NAS
    PSU
    Seasonic Prime Titanium 850W
    Case
    Thermaltake Core P3 wall mounted
    Cooling
    Corsair Hydro H115i
    Keyboard
    Logitech wireless K800
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1 Gbps Download and 35 Mbps Upload
    Browser
    Google Chrome
    Antivirus
    Microsoft Defender and Malwarebytes Premium
    Other Info
    Logitech Z625 speaker system,
    Logitech BRIO 4K Pro webcam,
    HP Color LaserJet Pro MFP M477fdn,
    Linksys EA9500 router,
    Motorola MB8611 cable modem,
    APC SMART-UPS RT 1000 XL - SURT1000XLI,
    Galaxy S20 Ultra 5G phone
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro for Workstations
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    HP Spectre x360 2in1
    CPU
    i7-1065G7 3.9 GHz
    Memory
    16 GB LPDDR4-3200
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Plus
    Sound Card
    Intel SST
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3" 4K UWVA AMOLED multitouch
    Screen Resolution
    3840 x 2160
    Hard Drives
    512 GB PCIe NVMe M.2 SSD
    Browser
    Google Chrome
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender and Malwarebytes Premium

Judiver

Judiver
Thread Starter
Local time
10:11 AM
Posts
31
Location
France
OS
Windows11
Yes, I realized that later on. The Start Menu is superposed by Windows Search when you type in the search box at the top of the Start Menu. If you type on the orb you get a different type of search.

I actually do not use either of them that often (but was doing unusual things, so looking for unusual things), so I was surprised to get a different screen all of a sudden, and on top of that with suggestions (never seen/had before) with pics, and moreover with French text... Not that I have anything against the French language, it just points me to the fact that my IP address (or other data on my laptop stating that I'm in France) is used anyway, even if I have deselected tracking on location and my whole laptop is in English.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows11
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Acer Aspire 5 A517
    CPU
    i7-8550U @1.80GHz 1.99GHz
    Memory
    8GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    NVIDIA GeForce MX150
    Sound Card
    Realtek HIgh Definition Audio (SST)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17.3" IPS
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080 (Full HD)
    Hard Drives
    SSD 256GB
    5400rpm HDD
    Keyboard
    qwerty

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