Still Win10 & hating the idea of switching to 11. I have QUESTIONS!

I built my previous PC on Vista. Sure there were problems but no more than usual AND I adored the sidebar. When I bought my current PC 4 1/2 years ago, it took some getting used to but, with the Start Menu, I was able to recreate those "tabs" I adored in Vista...and then some.

Now we're at Win11 (an OS that wasn't supposed to happen because Win10 was the guaranteed last one). I've been putting off the upgrade for a long time because I've read on it and it seems like it's removed so many features that it isn't really user-friendly anymore. My sister's PC updated to 11 without her OK and I've taken a look to see what it's like to navigate. I hate it. Here's where you come in.

I'm going to try and post a couple of screenshots of my Start Menu because it is the heart of my PC. Everything else doesn't matter so much but the ease with which I can navigate, added to the 12 years with my Vista PC...that's 16 years that Microsoft may well be demanding I let go of for something quite inferior. What I want to know is what is Win11's answer to this? What is the counterpoint to this? Is there anything similar to this in Win11 that I just don't know about? What's the closest I can get to simulating this?

Additionally, as a little side inquiry, what are the chances of losing files and such when I upgrade? I already have my 100G of Sims stuff on a USB but there's obviously more there than that, LOL!

Thanks to any and all who respond to this and take my questions seriously, understanding they are important to me.

Comment: I got my first computer in '92 with MS-DOS 5 and Windows 3.1, retired 2 years later and got job in a computer store, ended up building computers. After that job ended I went freelance. I've owned computers with every version of Windows except Vista and ME although I've worked on them. Also had computers with WinNT 3.51, 4 and 2000. The main thing is that we only license the use of Windows and are faced with always changing, not that hard to learn. Win11 still works with what Win10 could but mostly a visual, some things are move around. The most frequent uses by a User are not hard to find, just give it a bit of time to adjust. Some of the changes are for security against the foibles of users and what they do.

1) Never heard that Windows 10 was supposed to be the last OS version. That simply wouldn't make sense for a company that designs and sells Operating Systems.

2) You should be creating Disk Images on a regular basis. That way you would not be concerned about potentially losing data. As for the likelihood of losing data, assuming you don't do anything silly during the upgrade, you'll be fine.

3) There are any number of utilities available that will allow the W11 start menu to look just like the W10 start menu. I use Explorer Patcher combined with Open Shell Menu. They are both free, both outstanding, and pretty much plug and play for those who don't like to fiddle, but offer plenty of options for those who do. Many others use StartAllBack instead, which is an inexpensive alternative to what I do. I've looked at it in the past and never cared for it but as I say, many others love it.

Bottom line, while I understand being comfortable with what you have, I'm a big proponent of using the latest available Operating System (assuming it fits my needs). Older versions eventually sunset and that means no more security updates.

Hope this helps - and welcome to the forum

You can always try Windows 11 and if you don't like Windows 11 roll back to Windows 10 also you can extend roll back time limit.

In this guide, you’ll learn the steps to use DISM commands to set the number of days after an upgrade that you can uninstall the upgrade before the system deletes the previous version.

I love 11, but do not expect it to be to your liking out of the box. It is definitely NOT Vista. There are third party apps and hundreds of tutorials here on the forum that can help you change many things about it, so it will require some reading and work on your part. But a few things are hardcoded and can not be changed.
While it's easier to stay with the old and familiar, the world of computing is forever changing. We have to learn to change with it.
As was mentioned, in this day and age I would not recommend anyone use an operating system after MS no longer patches it. It's just not worth the security risk.

I strongly recommend you have some backup solution in place. Most of us here make regular images of our system.

Berton said:

Comment: I got my first computer in '92 with MS-DOS 5 and Windows 3.1, retired 2 years later and got job in a computer store, ended up building computers. After that job ended I went freelance. I've owned computers with every version of Windows except Vista and ME although I've worked on them. Also had computers with WinNT 3.51, 4 and 2000. The main thing is that we only license the use of Windows and are faced with always changing, not that hard to learn. Win11 still works with what Win10 could but mostly a visual, some things are move around. The most frequent uses by a User are not hard to find, just give it a bit of time to adjust. Some of the changes are for security against the foibles of users and what they do.

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I got my first PC in '91-'92 as well! Then '00, '08 (built), and now '20. First game I bought was "Civilization"!

I'm not nearly as versed as you are and, now that I'm 64, find that my brain, while I could easily learn this stuff, just really doesn't want to. Having had 16 years of being able to not only easily access my apps but to have them grouped all nice and neat, once again, Microsoft is throwing out the stuff that works for nonsense that deteriorates the user-friendly portion. W10 got rid of the Media Center stuff that, while imperfect, was useful. Seems they're really interested in getting rid of stuff and making it so people have to make additional purchases if they want that function back. Ugh. My PC is recreational and all of the added stuff seems to accommodate people who work from home. I honestly don't want to have to go get apps and mess around with trying to set something up that's as easy as what I already have. You know how I find my "frequent" apps? I open Start. That's it. Sigh...

Don’t worry about needing to roll back or reinstall 10. Just make a system image and reload it if you think Windows 11 is going to make your head explode. It has happened, like spontaneous combustion, and being speared by a Unicorn.

There are ways to get the old style menu’s back, if you were able to do it in Ten, you should be able to do the same in Eleven.
(I know you can do the above menu you have shown, with Stardock Start11)

And Welcome to the ElevenForum

allan said:

1) Never heard that Windows 10 was supposed to be the last OS version. That simply wouldn't make sense for a company that designs and sells Operating Systems.

2) You should be creating Disk Images on a regular basis. That way you would not be concerned about potentially losing data. As for the likelihood of losing data, assuming you don't do anything silly during the upgrade, you'll be fine.

3) There are any number of utilities available that will allow the W11 start menu to look just like the W10 start menu. I use Explorer Patcher combined with Open Shell Menu. They are both free, both outstanding, and pretty much plug and play for those who don't like to fiddle, but offer plenty of options for those who do. Many others use StartAllBack instead, which is an inexpensive alternative to what I do. I've looked at it in the past and never cared for it but as I say, many others love it.

Bottom line, while I understand being comfortable with what you have, I'm a big proponent of using the latest available Operating System (assuming it fits my needs). Older versions eventually sunset and that means no more security updates.

Hope this helps - and welcome to the forum

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"At the 2015 Ignite conference, Microsoft employee Jerry Nixon stated that Windows 10 would be the "last version of Windows", a statement reflecting the company's intent to apply the software as a service business model to Windows, with new versions and updates to be released over an indefinite period.[56][57][58] In 2021, however, Microsoft announced that Windows 10 would be succeeded on compatible hardware by Windows 11–and that Windows 10 support will end on October 14, 2025, marking a departure from what had been dubbed "Windows as a service"."

I get how you think I'm just change-averse but that's not it at all. My needs/wants are far different from a generation who conducts their computer business on phones, which is what W11 is really gearing toward. I've literally owned computers for 33 years, so I've seen the changes and fully understand that not upgrading means no more updates. (I had Vista for 12 years and was finally pushed to purchasing another PC because I couldn't even get on the internet due to lack of support.) I've also seen MS discard popular features, then tell users they can emulate those if they want to purchase other stuff. I just don't feel comfortable upgrading to 11, THEN poking around to see how I can possibly find stuff only to discover I have to get an app, or three, to try and make it work. Thus, this post. I was aiming for providing a screenshot of what matters to me and getting feedback as to whether or not this was a feature of 11, because with what I've seen, it isn't. I've helped out my sister with a few things on hers and I honestly can't find a thing. She has a hard time, too, even after more than a year.

Thanks for the "welcome"... I'd hoped never to come here, LOL!

LT23 said:

I'd hoped never to come here, LOL!

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Now that you’re here, best that you learn early that I am in fact… Batman.

Everyone is here to help you along the way, just ask

I have owned pcs since 1987, and gone through many changes, from DOS to Win 11. I had Windows 3.1, Windows 95, 98, Windows 7, 10, and 11. Didn't like the tiles on Win 10, so I used Classic Shell (with Win 7 type interface), which crashed Win 11 when I updated to my newest PC and tried to install Classic Shell. Went back to the original interface with Win 11. Have been using it ever since. It essentially works a bit like Win 7, and with no tiles. With some updates and tweaks, I have gotten used to it. It seems relatively stable and fast. Yeah, some of my old programs had to bite the dust, but it turned out to be compatible with some old programs and peripherals Win 10 wasn't. Everything is a trade-off. Just a new learning curve. Welcome to the Win 11 forum!

glasskuter said:

I love 11, but do not expect it to be to your liking out of the box. It is definitely NOT Vista. There are third party apps and hundreds of tutorials here on the forum that can help you change many things about it, so it will require some reading and work on your part. But a few things are hardcoded and can not be changed.
While it's easier to stay with the old and familiar, the world of computing is forever changing. We have to learn to change with it.
As was mentioned, in this day and age I would not recommend anyone use an operating system after MS no longer patches it. It's just not worth the security risk.

I strongly recommend you have some backup solution in place. Most of us here make regular images of our system.

Click to expand...

Vista got a lot of hate but I liked it well enough...didn't have the problems many others did. Never understood why Microsoft didn't provide a free upgrade to Win7, knowing Vista was unpopular. Makes this whole free upgrade to Win11 even more puzzling.

I've owned PCs for 33 years so I do know about change and this isn't about change. This is about an OS that doesn't fit my needs. I've been using Win10 for the past 4+ years and am perfectly fine with it (so switching from Vista wasn't an issue). What is important to me is what I've partly shown with the screenshots...a recreational PC that is easy to navigate. What I've seen of Win11 is actually what I expected - an OS that is more geared to the current generation of users who work from home, leaving the user-friendly interface behind. Each upgrade has actually eliminated features for recreational use, pushing users to make purchases if they still want those things.

Anyway, there seems to be a lot of focus on my being change-averse, but that isn't true. What I was looking for was something more definitive about how my current method for navigating "favorites" would translate to Win11. I've shown what I like and want to know if that's something I will be able to have with an upgrade. And without additional costs or too much work. I've built a PC, upgraded them (incl the current one) and worked out Black (or Blue) screens of death so it's not that I can't research, etc., but I am 64 and mostly would rather not have to go through all of that. When you get to be my age, you'll understand, LOL.

And the bit about losing info I quickly added at the end is more a matter of addressing what I've read about the fears of others who've had horror stories of losing stuff, including my sister's unexpected upgrade. I backup to an extent...again, mostly recreational.

Thanks for responding!

LT23 said:

Now we're at Win11 (an OS that wasn't supposed to happen because Win10 was the guaranteed last one).

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Yeah, that was an off the cuff statement by an employee but it was never really corroborated by Microsoft, nor were they any whitepapers published or anything confirming that statement or explaining it.

Obviously changes were still going to be coming, even if it was just called just "windows" rather than Windows 10, Windows 11, or Windows 12.

LT23 said:

My sister's PC updated to 11 without her OK

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I've not had any of my Windows 10 PC's automatically upgrade themselves to Windows 11. I still have 4 desktops in my house running on Windows 10.


I really don't use the start menu at all. I either have a shortcut on desktop, item pinned to taskbar, and for anything else (like calculator), i just hit the Windows Key, type calc and hit enter.

LT23 said:

but I am 64 and mostly would rather not have to go through all of that

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Most of the members here that I communicate with privately are between 70 and near 90 years old.

antspants said:

Don’t worry about needing to roll back or reinstall 10. Just make a system image and reload it if you think Windows 11 is going to make your head explode. It has happened, like spontaneous combustion, and being speared by a Unicorn.

There are ways to get the old style menu’s back, if you were able to do it in Ten, you should be able to do the same in Eleven.
(I know you can do the above menu you have shown, with Stardock Start11)

And Welcome to the ElevenForum

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You do know that spontaneous combustion is a real thing, right? Can't say the same for unicorns.

I KNOW I will have to upgrade at some point but my navigation ability (Cap rising so I do like my organization stuff!) is so important to me that I've been dragging my feet for sooooo long. Guess I'm just silly enough to think MS will realize how ridiculous they are and work this interface back in.

LOL and thanks for the link - it absolutely proves my point ... MS gets rid of useful and popular features so they can turn around and sell them back to users.

antspants said:

Most of the members here that I communicate with privately are between 70 and near 90 years old.

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That's awfully nice of you. Truly. My parents are in that age group and they never really had the chance to get too comfortable with the whole computer thing.

I'm not putting myself in that group because, like I said, I've been using PCs since the late 80s (owned my 1st in 91 or 92) and have built/upgraded/fixed a few here and there. I don't know how old you are, and you probably already know it because of your "clients", but a fact of getting older isn't so much being unable to think, but your brain getting bored with the research part when it's less about facts and more about all kinds of information that's just doesn't seem relevant. Sort of like adult ADHD.

pparks1 said:

I really don't use the start menu at all. I either have a shortcut on desktop, item pinned to taskbar, and for anything else (like calculator), i just hit the Windows Key, type calc and hit enter.

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I'm glad that system works for you. However, my post was more about how I use Windows and whether or not I can get the same sort of navigational ease out of Win11.

LT23 said:

Can't say the same for unicorns.

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OY! this is my weekend job

LT23 said:

That's awfully nice of you. Truly. My parents are in that age group and they never really had the chance to get too comfortable with the whole computer thing.

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Nope, my friend, they are a lot more knowledgeable than I am when it comes to Windows 11, so it’s the other way around.

LT23 said:

I'm not putting myself in that group because, like I said, I've been using PCs since the late 80s

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That group, is the group you will get many answers to your questions from.

LT23 said:

I'm glad that system works for you. However, my post was more about how I use Windows and whether or not I can get the same sort of navigational ease out of Win11.

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Yeah, I just didn't want you to think that I was neglecting to respond to that portion of your post.......I just don't have anything constructive for that part of the post.

LT23 said:

I'm glad that system works for you. However, my post was more about how I use Windows and whether or not I can get the same sort of navigational ease out of Win11

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Here is a random image from Stardock Start11



Here is an unorganised example I took trying to convince a new member that I could fit over 100 (in fact hundred's of) icons in that style of start menu (from Start11)



Yes that’s the menu not the desktop, I was just playing to see how many down and across I could fit, let alone the fact that I can create endless group tabs, so multiply it by potato.

Here’s the formula for icons that can fit.

X x Y √ß´6 x † ≈ X x π = 4 x ^ = Make up any number

antspants said:

Here is a random image from Stardock Start11

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I live 4 miles from the stardock headquarters here in Michigan.