Solved AI PCs aren't selling, and Microsoft's PC partners are scrambling

XxXxX said:

i used Ubuntu for 20 years Windows is not my preferred operating system.
Ubuntu moved to snap packages and after Ubuntu 24.04 LTS it became near impossible to remove snaps

so i throw Windows on my system which works but Windows isnt an operating system i would choose
but i have found a Ubuntu based operating system without snaps
it uses deb's and Flatpaks, you even get to choose which ones you want, just like pick'n'mix
and that system is Zorin OS which i am playing with in Virtual box at the moment
Zorin OS is based on Ubuntu but without any of the snap packages
it will be installed very soon on both mine and my wife's system, just ironing out the bugs.

so if Microsoft wants to push then i will just shove Windows elsewhere.
best of luck Steve ..

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My point was not about using Linux as an alternative to Windows (that boring comparison has been going on for years) but more that going that route just because one is anti-AI (I am too) does not make sense to me as you can just ignore Crapalot as I do.

However, in the end, it is your choice of course.

FDretired said:

I am confused.

I have the latest windows 11 and Copilot was included as an app.
Copilot is now in my taskbar.

If I have to search for information on ANYTHING I will first use CoPilot

The answers are very quick and accurate. Latest search. We are going for
a holiday to South Africa and wanted to know about a restaurant close
to where we have rented a condo. Restaurant - MiHa Melrose Arch

Below is Copilots response


MiHa Melrose Arch — Quick Overview
* Cuisine: Contemporary fusion with strong Mediterranean and Middle Eastern influence
* Vibe: Trendy, stylish, social — great for evenings out
* Rating: 4.2 ★ (949 reviews)
* Hours: Open now, closes 11:30 p.m.
* Address: Melrose Shop HL48, Melrose Arch, Johannesburg
* Website: miha.co.za

Is there any risk to me for me using Copilot?

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I find CP is excellent and doesn't have a daily use limit like ChatGPT. CP uses the GPT5 engine anyway. I only ever use CP in a web browser and it remembers previous chats if you are logged in with your Microsoft account.

XxXxX said:

if i wanted a new computer without AI and it wasn't available

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You're doing it wrong!

hdmi said:

You're doing it wrong!

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thats very neat but i still dont want to use AI
the only AI i use sometimes sits in front of the keyboard

but thanks for the heads up.
best of luck Steve ..

Borg 386 said:

Myself, I wouldn't want an AI PC just because IMHO it's another vector of personal info gathering.

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I just can't see why I need AI for my everyday PC use. I've used PCs all my life (over 40 years) and still use it exactly the same way I used Win 95.

BarryGuff said:

I just can't see why I need AI for my everyday PC use. I've used PCs all my life (over 40 years) and still use it exactly the same way I used Win 95.

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That's exactly how I feel about Windows: I need it (any version of it), but all the new stuff I always avoid and disable directly after installation.

This is exactly what MS has earned by not respecting privacy rights or paying attention to what customers want.

cereberus said:

Its use in hearing aid technology development has led to significant improvement in assisting hearing aid users hear speech with loud background noise for example.

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I find that interesting. Do you have any links to articles on the subject?

`I suspect that there are (and will be) many more computer users who are interested in the potential benefits of what is currently being marketed as 'AI' than there are 'nay-sayers' and, as time passes and a new generation of users grows in the presence of 'AI' the interest, it will continue to advance as it always has done since home computers began to become common-place - only about 50 years ago. In fact we have each been using some form of AI since our first personal use of a PC. What else is spell-check in a word-processor or the use of a Search Engine but the direct application of 'AI'. Those features and many other 'artificial' user help features have always been promoted as selling-points for both hardware and software; just not in constantly flashing lights or labelled as 'AI'.

IMO singling out MS is pointless, as they are simply one amongst many IT corporations pursuing the same course; and that does include many of the major players who influence much of the development in the Linux arena, where steady growth in the introduction of 'modern AI; features is now also gaining more and more traction both via by the direct inclusion of AI features in OS design and/or by its inclusion in individual applications, including the majority of popular internet browsers/search engines. As for the often mentioned privacy concerns, why not attach equal blame to Google for its leading influence on the development of highly intrusive online services, Amazon for the development of 'Alexa', Smart 'Phone developers, or even retail services for the growth in customer loyalty schemes? They're all paddling the same canoe up the same river.

To me, the best course of action is simply use what you want to use; and don't use what you don't want to use. A staunch argumentative approach tends to come across simplistically as just the extremism of vocal minorities; which itself tends to be ignored by those who have any real influence over decisions; and rarely achieve any significant impact beyond an individual's own choice; i.e. Somewhat like the extreme and circular arguments about which Operating System is 'best', where the only honest answer is "The one which best suits the specific needs of an organisation and/or individual user". If an individual chooses a Linux route. then that's great choice for them, but not a reason to constantly argue/promote that choice on a forum that is primarily designed to help Windows users to get the best out of a specific Windows OS; and it's insulting to those who's choice is Windows, for whatever reason.

I am totally unapologetic for creating this response on an Apple MacBook Pro/macOS 26, which is my primary choice for much of my daily usage, including running Windows 11 ARM VMs, but not for everyone; and your choice is yours alone' and I fully respect that

LeLibran said:

`I suspect that there are (and will be) many more computer users who are interested in the potential benefits of what is currently being marketed as 'AI' than there are 'nay-sayers' and, as time passes and a new generation of users grows in the presence of 'AI' the interest, it will continue to advance as it always has done since home computers began to become common-place - only about 50 years ago.

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Yes, making people even more and more helpless as time goes on because they lack the life skills necessary to do things on their own

"gee, muh smartphone broke! i dunno wha ta du! i dunno wha ta du! i cant du anythin bruh! i cant du anythin!"

derr...duhh...dohh... derr...duhh...dohh...

LeLibran said:

IMO singling out MS is pointless, ...

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True, but this is a Windows forum so it's gonna happen

LeLibran said:

As for the often mentioned privacy concerns, why not attach equal blame to Google for its leading influence on the development of highly intrusive online services, Amazon for the development of 'Alexa', Smart 'Phone developers, or even retail services for the growth in customer loyalty schemes? They're all paddling the same canoe up the same river.

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Oh no doubt. It's the latest narcotic bandwagon everybody has to join, otherwise they'll be 'left behind'.

Again, MS will take the brunt of it here because of this being a Windows forum. Even privacy-orientated DuckuckGo and Brave will have AI included in them and fortunately we can turn them off. For the moment, anyway...

LeLibran said:

To me, the best course of action is simply use what you want to use; and don't use what you don't want to use. A staunch argumentative approach tends to come across simplistically as just the extremism of vocal minorities;

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Minorities who say never throw caution to the wind...

LeLibran said:

which itself tends to be ignored by those who have any real influence over decisions;

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Well you know the old saying: Money talks, you-know-what walks.

LeLibran said:

and rarely achieve any significant impact beyond an individual's own choice; i.e. Somewhat like the extreme and circular arguments about which Operating System is 'best', where the only honest answer is "The one which best suits the specific needs of an organisation and/or individual user".

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In an ideal world, that's supposed to be true. But since when has it ever been ideal, anyway...

LeLibran said:

If an individual chooses a Linux route. then that's great choice for them, but not a reason to constantly argue/promote that choice on a forum that is primarily designed to help Windows users to get the best out of a specific Windows OS; and it's insulting to those who's choice is Windows, for whatever reason.

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Yup, more damage has been done to the Linux cause by doing that than probably anything else. Beating that dead horse to the wind.

LeLibran said:

I am totally unapologetic for creating this response on an Apple MacBook Pro/macOS 26, which is my primary choice for much of my daily usage, including running Windows 11 ARM VMs, but not for everyone; and your choice is yours alone' and I fully respect that

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Different strokes for different folks. Nothing wrong with that.

I have no great love for Windows. I'd dump it in a heartbeat if something else will run the programs that I want.

There's 3 types of people in the modern days IT World: The ones that use A.I. , the ones that are used by A.I., and the ones that fear A.i.

Scarcity aside... quite ironic for I'm about to say, Microsoft as a corporate IT brand - was always afraid of missing out on the best new thing. So if other major corporate brands invested in something - that became popular - Microsoft did the same (afraid of being late to the party - again, as it happened with Windows Smartphones - where, by the time Microsoft joined - the gap between Windows and Android/iOS Smartphones was to far apart - not to mention - the Windows way of doing things where they kept changing architectures was yet another nail in that coffin). Seeing Google's success with their search engine - invested heavily in their own search engine Bing. Seeing the popularity of Chrome - they gave up on I.E. and a engine of their own - and built their next browser using Chromium. Same goes for A.I. - EVERY MAJOR IT Corporation - is investing heavily in it and Microsoft - was hoping to get a big part of this A.I. Pie as well.

Windows is still just the OS, all the major Hardware Corporations out there - have A.I. embed in their latest hardware. If you truly wanna give up on A.I and sort of go off-grid (A.I. wise) - then you'd have to give up on modern tech and switch to old tech with no A.I. support. I mean, for a high-end consumer GPU (like RTX 5xxx series or equivalent) - you pay around 25% to 40% of the retail price for the A.I. (both directly - like the Dedicated AI hardware, but also indirectly - like the recent VRAM tax and opportunity costs). This percentages are lower for a modern CPU (around 25% would be the max cost), but still - you gotta pay for it.... you can't just ask the vendor - to deduct the A.I. side, cause it's not your thing. Unless, as mentioned above - you choose to die on the older tech hill. Which frankly, it's a rather humane thing to do.... historically speaking. Same was for our ancestors or even our parents - deeming the latest tech as confusing or immoral, unless... that could be adapted to their old ways of doing things.

As the old saying goes: "You can't teach an old dog new tricks." Even tho, it goes deeper than that... Since this is another new invention that can change the world for better or worst (loosing jobs which were already hard to get - even back when A.I. wasn't around, the corporate competition for A.I. - is starting to have a really heavy toll on the average consumer market - costs wise, wasting tons upon tons of limited resources on A.I. used for the silliest most trivial tasks, A.I. being used and trained immorally - at the expense of others and so on and so forth). So no, i'm not advocating for A.I. blindly - quite the opposite... i prefer to take evidence into account. That being said, while the average consumer market is rather pissed at A.I. - the corporate consumers and investors are still pushing A.I. harder than ever. Just take the latest CES event into account, Samsung for example...

neves said:

To summarize:

"A.i... a.i.... A.i.... Samsung..... A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... Samsung... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i..... Smart... A.I.... . A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung.... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung... A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i.... Improved... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... Samsung A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i.....Samsung A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.. A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i... improved.... A.i..... A.i.... A.i..... A.i.A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... Samsung A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Innovations... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... and... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung ....A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... 2026... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Samsung... A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i...A.i.... A.i..... A.i... Thank You! A.i."

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To be fair, the CEO of this corporate giants - are making billions of $ and this are some of the greediest people on this planet - so it's only natural for them to be excited - and praise the Goose who's laying Golden Eggs for them. Same way - it's natural for a consumer who's on the losing side of this deals - to be pissed for not being able to afford an upgrade - despite raising a reasonable amount - which should have been more than enough (based on the calculations he made last summer).

Ghot said:

MS made a huge mistake. They didn't get AI working before they tried to sell it.

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This is hardly the first time. The rationale is that they do not want to be left in the dust while GOOGLE and other competitors continue to make a killing in data collection. The end user has been the MS guinea pig ever since they fired their beta testers (and that was a long time ago). The entire debacle reads like a bad Soilent Green script: We . . . are the commodity. Yup. I realize corporations need to make record profits, but they would do well to bear in mind that most folks like their options and their privacy. While MS pretends to honour this the temptation to betray those things is more than it can withstand. After all, the bottom line takes precedence over all things. MS is no exception to this. Don't be Evil GOOGLE has behaved in like same manner and so has others.

Blaming the corporation is fool hardy. The corporation is a money-making machine. It does what it is told to do. It has no conscience. It cannot fathom right from wrong. A corporation is incapable of exercising ethics. All it knows is the price of lunch and keeps on eating until it can't. We've all heard the expression, "Don't feed the troll". Well, this is something other. For as long as we keep feeding these 'too big to fail' entities they will continue doing what they do best. I would go so far as to say that the next generation is lost to AI.

At my daughter's grade 12 graduation I watched half a dozen students give Chat GPT the credit for their diplomas. In fact, one young man stated plainly, "Give my diploma to Chat GPT". In the mean time, AI is being foisted upon us at every turn whether we want it or not. The psychology is simple: Make it look like the end user has an option. (They know we like options.) The reality is the only real option we have is to stop using AI altogether. Well, have fun with that.

IMO the "Golden Age" of computing is gone. It has morphed into something other. I can't paint a Pollyanna picture for anyone here in good conscience. When I take a good look around me I can see what the next goal will be: The removal of the PC. The goal being that we will all be completely internet dependent while everything will be networked via the meagre devices i.e. tablets, smart phones, fit bits, GPS, etc. that many of us use in day-to-day living. The process has already begun: The land fills and recycling stations are full. The cost of DRAM has tripled. The paradigm shift in human consciousness has already started and the advocates of trans-humanism and AI have enough clout to push it on through.

XxXxX said:

so if Microsoft wants to push then i will just shove Windows elsewhere.
best of luck Steve ..

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This is about the only option left to us, Steve. Even then I daresay it isn't likely to last. I still use ethernet and we all know that's archaic these days. Who needs a PC when they have WiFi? Who needs those klunky old cumbersome devices when you can take your computing with you wherever you go with a tiny little device that will let you access a super computer? No cables, no strings, no muss, no fuss. Let AI do it all for you. Seriously. Who wants to lug around a lap top? Some of us can see where this is going. We're only one step away.