Are you happy with Windows 11

Marie SWE said:

If you dont have anything to hide, then you dont have to worry.

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I'm not doing anything illegal in the restroom either, but that doesn't mean I want everyone watching.

pseymour said:

I'm not doing anything illegal in the restroom either, but that doesn't mean I want everyone watching.

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That one is also sooo true..
I dont do anything illegal either.. but i do have a ton of things i do want to hide. some of it extra sensitive.. But that i do have both encrypted and air gapped.

Marie SWE said:

If you dont have anything to hide, then you dont have to worry.

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On top of that I don't what piles of personal information stored on some server waiting to be hacked and made totally public. Even IF I trusted the government to see information, that doesn't mean I trust them to guard the information.

Win711 said:

On top of that I don't what piles of personal information stored on some server waiting to be hacked and made totally public. Even IF I trusted the government to see information, that doesn't mean I trust them to guard the information.

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That is exactly the point and the ongoing discussion among IT-security people that is trying to convince the idiots making the bills it is a really-really bad idea to build in backdoors to software and operating systems. a door always have two ways in... with the key.... and pick the lock.
The best example in the world in present time is in the USA with the phone system that is abused but was created for the NSA.
and before that it was in another country.. and then unpatched holes just to have it as a backdoor.. Eternalblue and Pegasus etc.

Marie SWE said:

That is exactly the point and the ongoing discussion among IT-security people that is trying to convince the idiots making the bills it is a really-really bad idea to build in backdoors to software and operating systems. a door always have two ways in... with the key.... and pick the lock.
The best example in the world in present time is in the USA with the phone system that is abused but was created for the NSA.
and before that it was in another country.. and then unpatched holes just to have it as a backdoor.. Eternalblue and Pegasus etc.

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Why do they need backdoors when people are more than willing to comply? To ACH between banks a lot of times the only way is to surrender a username and password to a 3rd party called Plaid, and evidently no one finds that odd. Even though Plaid has been sued before for impropriety, people still happily give them their login credentials.

When I do business with my bank, it's always between me and my bank, except if I want to use the mobile app, then my bank offloads the security to the Play Store, which means I need a google account to deposit a check. I can't imagine 30 years ago any bank requiring a client to go to something called "The Play Store" in order to do banking.

To file taxes we're forced to use 3rd party software. To pay tax bills we're forced to use a 3rd party service.

The government compels people to include a 3rd party when none is required, which is a gigantic security risk, and people "have nothing to hide" so they don't protest.

Win711 said:

Why do they need backdoors when people are more than willing to comply? To ACH between banks a lot of times the only way is to surrender a username and password to a 3rd party called Plaid, and evidently no one finds that odd. Even though Plaid has been sued before for impropriety, people still happily give them their login credentials.

When I do business with my bank, it's always between me and my bank, except if I want to use the mobile app, then my bank offloads the security to the Play Store, which means I need a google account to deposit a check. I can't imagine 30 years ago any bank requiring a client to go to something called "The Play Store" in order to do banking.

To file taxes we're forced to use 3rd party software. To pay tax bills we're forced to use a 3rd party service.

The government compels people to include a 3rd party when none is required, which is a gigantic security risk, and people "have nothing to hide" so they don't protest.

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I have never heard of Plaid. so I'm guessing its not a thing here in sweden.
Yeah apps on smartphones is a bigger problem then many thinks.. But you dont have to use an app in most cases as you can use the web browser in stead of many apps.
As for me i dont use a smartphone as i have no real use for one and i dont think tech is "cool".. and also my computers is hundred times better then any smartphone and it has big screens, real keyboard etc.. Then i use a classic cellphone(dumbphone) to make calls... I do have IP phone, but its just cheaper to call with my mobile phone.
Interesting that your government is forcing 3rd party on you. But I'm not even for a second surprised thogh.

Marie SWE said:

I have never heard of Plaid. so I'm guessing its not a thing here in sweden.

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You're lucky. It used to be that to link bank accounts, one bank would send some amounts less than $1 then immediately retrieve the deposits, then you had to tell the bank how much the deposits were in order to prove you own the account. Now they use Plaid instead, and Plaid requires giving them your username and password to your bank account. Plaid will then verify you own the account. It's crazy!


"The company has faced controversy for scraping user data, impersonating bank login screens, and not properly disclosing the privacy risks associated with the service.[26] TD Bank filed a lawsuit against Plaid in 2020 accusing the company of trying to "dupe" its users.[27]

In 2021, Plaid settled a $58 million class action lawsuit over claims that it passed on personal banking data to third party firms without user consent. The settlement encompasses five separate lawsuits combined as one. Each claims that Plaid used consumers’ banking login credentials to gather and distribute detailed financial data without prior consent.[28]

Plaid has "exploited its position as middleman," the plaintiffs alleged. Approximately 98 million people are affected by the settlement. Claimants will be given the option to receive the settlement money automatically through payment platforms such as PayPal and Venmo."

Marie SWE said:

Yeah apps on smartphones is a bigger problem then many thinks.. But you dont have to use an app in most cases as you can use the web browser in stead of many apps.

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My options to deposit a check is to send them the check through the mail, open an account at a bank that has a branch that I can walk into and then wire the funds to my online bank, or have a google account and the mobile app to deposit the check electronically.

I can't believe more people aren't bothered.

Win711 said:

You're lucky. It used to be that to link bank accounts, one bank would send some amounts less than $1 then immediately retrieve the deposits, then you had to tell the bank how much the deposits were in order to prove you own the account. Now they use Plaid instead, and Plaid requires giving them your username and password to your bank account. Plaid will then verify you own the account. It's crazy!

Plaid Inc. - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

"The company has faced controversy for scraping user data, impersonating bank login screens, and not properly disclosing the privacy risks associated with the service.[26] TD Bank filed a lawsuit against Plaid in 2020 accusing the company of trying to "dupe" its users.[27]

In 2021, Plaid settled a $58 million class action lawsuit over claims that it passed on personal banking data to third party firms without user consent. The settlement encompasses five separate lawsuits combined as one. Each claims that Plaid used consumers’ banking login credentials to gather and distribute detailed financial data without prior consent.[28]

Plaid has "exploited its position as middleman," the plaintiffs alleged. Approximately 98 million people are affected by the settlement. Claimants will be given the option to receive the settlement money automatically through payment platforms such as PayPal and Venmo."



My options to deposit a check is to send them the check through the mail, open an account at a bank that has a branch that I can walk into and then wire the funds to my online bank, or have a google account and the mobile app to deposit the check electronically.

I can't believe more people aren't bothered.

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I can understand why people aren't bother with it more then they are..
Most people do not understand the technology and therefore they cant understand the security risks.. It just "magically happens" Then on top they never-ever read the user agreements.. i read somewhere its only around 2% of people that actually read from start to the end and subpages of the user agreements, privacy policy and data collection. That include old classic papers as insurance company's etc. sends out .
So i am not surprised people dont react.
I remember a thread i made on tenforums saying, Finally, Microsoft is worse then Google about privacy. only facebook to beat to become number one.
One even called it disinformation when i copied some of the Microsofts privacy policy, saying i made it up.
So people do actually not read.. So i do not find it strange, that people think all is good as the big tech say.. we prioritize your privacy.

Edit: But i actually have to give a tiny-tiny-bit credit to microsoft on the security improvement they actually have made on win11.. as windows on design is an insecure OS. It still is, but its better
and if it was an LTSC release then a lot of tweaking can make it a good OS... to bad that is a rolling release, so everything gets undone on a feature rollup.
So I'm going with Windows 2021 LTSC (as that one is the newest one and dont need TPM)

I've made my living trading online for 25 years and my bank transfers are direct between my broker and my bank. I've never heard of Plaid before.

Marie SWE said:

I can understand why people aren't bother with it more then they are..
Most people do not understand the technology and therefore they cant understand the security risks.. It just "magically happens" Then on top they never-ever read the user agreements.. i read somewhere its only around 2% of people that actually read from start to the end and subpages of the user agreements, privacy policy and data collection. That include old classic papers as insurance company's etc. sends out .
So i am not surprised people dont react.
I remember a thread i made on tenforums saying, Finally, Microsoft is worse then Google about privacy. only facebook to beat to become number one.
One even called it disinformation when i copied some of the Microsofts privacy policy, saying i made it up.
So people do actually not read.. So i do not find it strange, that people think all is good as the big tech say.. we prioritize your privacy.

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If people actually read the agreement they would never agree lol

The agreement for my smart tv said they own everything, can collect any data they want, I can't sue them in court for any reason, and if I don't like it then don't use the tv I just bought. So I turned the smart crap off and dedicated a laptop to the job.

And companies do not understand what agreement means since they think they're free to change the agreement anytime they want. What's the point of an agreement if the agreement can be changed on a whim? If they were honest they'd say "Please become reliant on our product, then once you're rooted in, we will change the terms and force you to agree."

I remember back in the 90s a cellphone company placed a fullpage newspaper ad "$50 a month for life". Of course I signed up, then it went to $60 lol. About 10 years later a class action suit made a bunch of lawyers rich and I got a check for a couple dollars.

TraderGary said:

I've made my living trading online for 25 years and my bank transfers are direct between my broker and my bank. I've never heard of Plaid before.

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Check out coinbase. I have to wire funds out of coinbase or else use Plaid. Deposits are by debit card since to ACH requires Plaid. Coinbase severed an established ACH link that I had used many times before, then wanted me to reestablish it via Plaid. I said no.

Bank of America was another one but evidently they recently made some changes that no longer require Plaid. Every chance I had to leave feedback I'd mention Plaid, so maybe they listened.


"Plaid settled a class action in which it agreed to pay $58 million to individuals who had used its interface, including Venmo, Robinhood, and Coinbase users. The lawsuit was based on Plaid acquiring more data than it needed and storing the user's bank account login credentials on Plaid's systems."

Win711 said:

If people actually read the agreement they would never agree lol

The agreement for my smart tv said they own everything, can collect any data they want, I can't sue them in court for any reason, and if I don't like it then don't use the tv I just bought. So I turned the smart crap off and dedicated a laptop to the job.

And companies do not understand what agreement means since they think they're free to change the agreement anytime they want. What's the point of an agreement if the agreement can be changed on a whim? If they were honest they'd say "Please become reliant on our product, then once you're rooted in, we will change the terms and force you to agree."

I remember back in the 90s a cellphone company placed a fullpage newspaper ad "$50 a month for life". Of course I signed up, then it went to $60 lol. About 10 years later a class action suit made a bunch of lawyers rich and I got a check for a couple dollars.

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Yeah if everyone know what some of us know, then they would have nightmares and never dare to plug in the internet connection. *lol*
as more insight and as more you learn and when you get to a point you actually get a bit paranoid by the knowlage as if the mouse cursor freeze up for one second, or you see a process name you dont remember by hart or some unexpected network activity.
So i think to some level of ignorance/lack of knowledge is actually a blessing.

Yeah.. i will never connect a smart TV to internet.. I do have my old dumb LCD TV, i have repaired it twice thogh.. and if i ever have to get one.. i will never connect it to internet and disable the wifi/bluetooth card/circuit.. i have had a computer connected to my TV since 1996 and i will continue down that road as a computer is much better in every ways.

darn $50 a month.. i did pay by the minute in those days, and i got a bill around $30 a month back in the mid 90's.. nowadays i pay $14 a month for unlimited calls, unlimited SMS and MMS and i also get 5GB data/month.. but as i have no smartphone.. i never use that.. and it builds up to the next month if i dont use it... so i think i have a round 200GB of data just laying around for no use.. But i do spend around 2-5hours a day on the phone.. so $14 is cheap

I made an edit to my last post.. as i had to actually say something nice.

Yeah Brink.. you can split up the thread 4-5-6 pages back and rename it to

Are you happy with Windows 11, splitted thread Privacy discussion

Marie SWE said:

when you get to a point you actually get a bit paranoid

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Yeah there's a balance point that I don't want to cross and then miss out on everything technology offers because I'm scared of cookies or something. But I also don't want to just hand everything to anyone who claims to be legit. There's a happy medium in there somewhere.

Marie SWE said:

Yeah.. i will never connect a smart TV to internet.. I do have my old dumb LCD TV, i have repaired it twice thogh.. and if i ever have to get one.. i will never connect it to internet and disable the wifi/bluetooth card/circuit.. i have had a computer connected to my TV since 1996 and i will continue down that road as a computer is much better in every ways.

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I clicked "do not agree" and the tv said I won't be able to connect to the net and blah blah all the stuff I will miss out on. I wasn't going to give it my wifi password anyway. Anything the tv can do, the laptop can do better. And instead of the clunky tv remote control shuffling a box around the screen with arrow buttons I can use a wireless mouse.

Marie SWE said:

darn $50 a month.. i did pay by the minute in those days, and i got a bill around $30 a month back in the mid 90's.. nowadays i pay $14 a month for unlimited calls, unlimited SMS and MMS and i also get 5GB data/month.. but as i have no smartphone.. i never use that.. and it builds up to the next month if i dont use it... so i think i have a round 200GB of data just laying around for no use.. But i do spend around 2-5hours a day on the phone.. so $14 is cheap

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I pay $14 a month too but back then $50 a month for unlimited minutes was a big deal.

Win711 said:

Yeah there's a balance point that I don't want to cross and then miss out on everything technology offers because I'm scared of cookies or something. But I also don't want to just hand everything to anyone who claims to be legit. There's a happy medium in there somewhere.



I clicked "do not agree" and the tv said I won't be able to connect to the net and blah blah all the stuff I will miss out on. I wasn't going to give it my wifi password anyway. Anything the tv can do, the laptop can do better. And instead of the clunky tv remote control shuffling a box around the screen with arrow buttons I can use a wireless mouse.



I pay $14 a month too but back then $50 a month for unlimited minutes was a big deal.

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It was my former work that pushed my knowledge forward.. Cookies are almost the last thing i worrying about.
I dont feel i miss out on any tech, as i have what i need and some.. I lost my interest for tech thanks to my work.. I hate computers and all OS's.. and the IoT smart devices is the most stupid things invented in my opinion.. i dont need my coffee maker to be smart or my vacuum cleaner or dishwasher, security system, or doors etc. even my cars is analog.. or almost at least. i do have fuel injection. but no GPS or that stuff.

Smartphones are just unnecessary in my life, i have actually challenge all my friends to convince me i need one.. and no one have manage to point out one single thing so far.. the challenge still stands ..... when i leave home, i want to be offline as its less stressful and i have all the time for my things i actually are doing.. The extremely few times i need internet with me.. then i bring a laptop.. last time was 2021 or 2020 i needed to bring internet with me to my garage.
if i had a smartphone for those times.. it would be out of date and no more security updates between times i need it. *lol*

yeah wifi.. i do have an AP that is powered down 99.99999% of the time.. i only power that one up if i need to test a computer i repairing.. Wifi is insecure(wpa3 is okay so far, buts its only a question of time), but for me is about reliability and performance and a bit easier security with wired network as someone actually have to break in to attempt to connect to my network.

you can not have privacy without security.. but you can have security without privacy.. as win11 and apple is proof of concept of.

darn.. its over 7am over here.. it's time to shut down for tonight and get a few hours of sleep.

Fun chatting with you
I hope Brink splitt the thread instead of cleaning house as i feel this security/privacy discussion is really needed now when Microsoft will push Recall

Good night folks.

No.

My answer to people who say, 'if you have nothing to hide why worry?' is net curtains. Anyone who lives nexr to a busy road will understand this.

kelper said:

My answer to people who say, 'if you have nothing to hide why worry?' is net curtains. Anyone who lives nexr to a busy road will understand this.

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Took me a minute to figure out "net curtains" means "fishing nets for curtains" and not "total demise" lol. I don't know if it's just an american thing but "curtains" can mean "lights out, pal". Probably from the gangster era of the 1930s.

But either way I fully agree

Scannerman said:

When someone tells me they have nothing to hide I just tell them to give me their bank account # and PIN#. After all, they have nothing to hide.

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"Saying that you don't care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about freedom of speech because you have nothing to say."

hdmi said:

"Saying that you don't care about the right to privacy because you have nothing to hide is no different than saying you don't care about freedom of speech because you have nothing to say."

Edward Snowden​

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It's one of my favourite quotes by Edward Snowden. Used to annoy my wife with it all the time because she's a U.S. citizen.