time to replace components in wife's computer for dreaded Win10 to Win11

bobkn · Saturday at 1:27 PM

spapakons said:
Didn't know that. I never tried to use ECC RAM because it was more expensive. "I am getting older always learning", as ancient Greeks said.

It's not universally true. My primary system uses DDR5 RDIMMs (registered DIMMs). They are not compatible with common UDIMMs.

gunrunnerjohn · Saturday at 1:29 PM

spapakons said:
Didn't know that. I never tried to use ECC RAM because it was more expensive. "I am getting older always learning", as ancient Greeks said.

I actually used to build what we jokingly called "high reliabilty" systems. We had the redundant power supplies that are typically used in servers, and I also used ECC memory. They were being used for trading systems for Wall Street bond trading firms. Some of them also were tied to a mirror system as a hot backup.

gunrunnerjohn · Saturday at 1:30 PM

bobkn said:
It's not universally true. My primary system uses DDR5 RDIMMs (registered DIMMs). They are not compatible with common UDIMMs.

Registered memory is a special case, that is true.

spapakons · Saturday at 1:30 PM

bobkn said:
It's not universally true. My primary system uses DDR5 RDIMMs (registered DIMMs). They are not compatible with common UDIMMs.

That's what I just read. Surely, some motherboards might accept ECC modules without the additional functionality, but it's the exception, not the rule. I remember trying a 2GB DDR ECC module on a standard motherboard and of course didn't work.

Scannerman · Saturday at 2:01 PM

DDR2 is like pushing into 20 years old. I think the last unit I owned using DDR2 was a Dell Inspiron 530 desk top. It ran surprisingly well and I eventually gave it to a family in the neighbourhood who are still using it and thoroughly enjoy it. Sadly, it only has Windows 10 on it so unless the children bring it back to me to fix for them they're on their own.

spapakons · Saturday at 2:11 PM

I just had a look at the latest official Memory Compatibility List from Asus support site, there in no reference to 16GB RAM modules, only 2x 8GB to reach 16GB, which I already have. Probably 16GB DDR3 modules are only supported on newer generation chipsets, not my 3rd generation Intel H61. I don't care much about it since I barely need over 12GB for what I do.

Scannerman · Saturday at 2:59 PM

spapakons said:
I just had a look at the latest official Memory Compatibility List from Asus support site, there in no reference to 16GB RAM modules, only 2x 8GB to reach 16GB, which I already have. Probably 16GB DDR3 modules are only supported on newer generation chipsets, not my 3rd generation Intel H61. I don't care much about it since I barely need over 12GB for what I do.

Linux is much more forgiving in this respect.

spapakons · Saturday at 3:35 PM

Scannerman said:
Linux is much more forgiving in this respect.

I will put pepper in your mouth. You mentioned the L word...

At normal use I need about 5-7GB. If I edit 2-3 videos at the same time or load any virtual machine, I may use 12GB+

gunrunnerjohn · Saturday at 3:54 PM

I ran with 16GB for many years and had no issues at all. The only reason this machine got 64GB was a mistake in ordering, I was going to give it 32GB. I blanked out and ordered a 32GB module, and then realized it wasn't a set but one module. So I just ordered another one. When I look at the memory in use after running for a spell, I've yet to see it above 16GB, right now it's running around 12GB.

spapakons · Saturday at 5:06 PM

At least you are future proof for a while. With that amount of RAM you can run 2-3 virtual machines at the same time and switch between Windows 11, Linux, Android (yes there is a x86 version for PCs and laptops) and even Mac OS.

Android-x86 - Porting Android to x86

Android-x86 is an Android Open Source Project licensed under Apache Public License 2.0. Some components are licensed under GNU General Public License (GPL) 2.0 or later.

www.android-x86.org

bobkn · Saturday at 5:12 PM

spapakons said:
I just had a look at the latest official Memory Compatibility List from Asus support site, there in no reference to 16GB RAM modules, only 2x 8GB to reach 16GB, which I already have. Probably 16GB DDR3 modules are only supported on newer generation chipsets, not my 3rd generation Intel H61. I don't care much about it since I barely need over 12GB for what I do.

I don't know whether to believe this:

Memory Finder - RAM Finder Tool | Newegg

Find the right RAM for your PC with Newegg's Memory Finder. Simplify your search with our easy-to-use RAM compatibility checker.

www.newegg.com

but the prices are ridiculous. 2X16GB DDR4 DIMMs from the leading makers start at about 50USD.

This is conjecture, but I believe the prices of obsolete stuff are high because they are mainly aimed at businesses or government offices that are doing repairs of gear they're unwilling to upgrade. For example: my last employer had equipment running NT4 or XP that they would have updates, because the price tag would have been tens of thousands per machine. The IT department wouldn't allow them on the LAN for security reasons. They had to find a means of connecting USB flash drives to the NT4 box to sneakernet data.

gunrunnerjohn · Saturday at 5:27 PM

I'd buy a new motherboard, memory, and processor, pretty much the same price. :lmao:

Scannerman · Saturday at 7:55 PM

gunrunnerjohn said:
I'd buy a new motherboard, memory, and processor, pretty much the same price.

Yabbut... You're missing the point. Think of the posterity.

gunrunnerjohn · Saturday at 8:31 PM

Scannerman said:
Yabbut... You're missing the point. Think of the posterity.

Yep, that's why I'd buy a new MB and processor, the old one can RIP.

I know there's some sort of contest to see how long you can keep an antique computer running, but I like to renew my equipment once in a while. After all, I worked all my life, socked away money for my golden years, and now I'm spending it.

If I didn't renew, I wouldn't have this cool monitor that works way better than the two monitors I was using! I love the flexibility of having all the windows I want and there's no monitor border running through the middle of them!

Different strokes for different folks, I can live with that.

After all, I'm keeping my ancient Microsoft Comfort Curve 2000 keyboard, I've really gotten used to them. I even have a couple of spares socked away for when this one finally give up the ghost. I actually wore the key legends off the keys of one of them, but it still works. These are my legacy equipment, I take these apart and fix them when keys start to stick or not register properly. So far, 100% revival rate.

spapakons · Saturday at 8:54 PM

Speaking of ancient equipment, I wouldn't replace my old Pentium 4 system if it could run Windows 8 32-bit and higher up to Windows 10 32-bit since 11 is 64-bit only. However, I don't regret it since my current less ancient system is much more faster. I'm sure a new one will be even faster, but as I said in an earlier post, I don't need that speed yet. Maybe after 5+ years, but then I would buy current technology refurbished for less than half the cost, or buy 18+ generation instead of current 14.

gunrunnerjohn · Saturday at 9:16 PM

If someone lives in SE-PA, I'd be glad to donate a few old computer carcasses to them, that would save me from looking for a place to recycle them.

spapakons · 2025-05-18T08:11:34-0400

I just read an article that very old computers (Windows XP, 2000 and even 3.1 and MS-DOS) are used in certain Transport sections in Germany and Bank ATMs. Here in Greece we are the same. Many businesses and schools also still use old Windows XP computers because is too expensive to replace them.

gunrunnerjohn · 2025-05-18T10:39:11-0400

spapakons said:
I just read an article that very old computers (Windows XP, 2000 and even 3.1 and MS-DOS) are used in certain Transport sections in Germany and Bank ATMs. Here in Greece we are the same. Many businesses and schools also still use old Windows XP computers because is too expensive to replace them.

Even our government in the US is using antique equipment, our air traffic control still has key computers that are floppy disk based! In many cases, it's not the physical replacement that's too expensive, it's modifying the systems that run on them to use the new technology.

spapakons · 2025-05-18T11:52:03-0400

What if they used new computers running the old Windows versions in a virtual machine until they upgrade the applications to use Windows 10/11? This could be possible. They could even install PCIe to IDE cards to use the old disk directly in the virtual machine (aka virtualize the old systems). I had done it for an old computer I had in my computer store. I removed the disk, connected to my current system and created a virtual machine using the disk directly rather than a virtual disk. It was running Windows Vista 32-bit. I booted it, installed VMware Tools and then I could access my store ERP application whenever I needed to see my customers' data.

gunrunnerjohn · 2025-05-18T12:10:00-0400

spapakons said:
What if they used new computers running the old Windows versions in a virtual machine until they upgrade the applications to use Windows 10/11? This could be possible. They could even install PCIe to IDE cards to use the old disk directly in the virtual machine (aka virtualize the old systems). I had done it for an old computer I had in my computer store. I removed the disk, connected to my current system and created a virtual machine using the disk directly rather than a virtual disk. It was running Windows Vista 32-bit. I booted it, installed VMware Tools and then I could access my store ERP application whenever I needed to see my customers' data.

Obviously, without actually knowing in detail what applications and other equipment is involved, it's impossible to know what is possible. However, running the old applications in VM's sounds to me like putting Band-Aids on bullet wounds, the real issue with systems like the air traffic control network is not just the ancient equipment but the capabilities of the existing system. That won't change putting the crappy system in a VM, it just needs to be totally replaced.

time to replace components in wife's computer for dreaded Win10 to Win11

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