Solved 4K alignment of HDDs. Is there any benefit?


Status report: Alignment (Partition Master Pro) completed. Now I feel a little foolish as I didn't preform any benchmarks prior with which to compare. Duh. Certainly agree it's fun to learn new things.

Anyway, here's the data afterwards. Given the relatively modest price of SSDs like the 2TB T7 (second image), it's hard to justify spending so much time conditioning an HDD.

CrystalDiskMark_20240913122129.png SSD.png
 
Last edited:

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TonyCzar said:
Status report: Alignment (Partition Master Pro) completed. Now I feel a little foolish as I didn't preform any benchmarks prior with which to compare. Duh. Certainly agree it's fun to learn new things.

Anyway, here's the data afterwards. Given the relatively modest price of SSDs like the 2TB T7 (second image), it's hard to justify spending so much time conditioning an HDD.

View attachment 108478 View attachment 108480
Click to expand...


Tony, could you explain exactly how you aligned and using what (im a bit of a dummy)
I’d like to follow your steps, I’m still interested in the time it took.

I also want to test it against just using Minitools

Thanks 🙏
 

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@antspants: Of course. I had previously conditioned a 1TB Toshiba external HDD using low-level format, convert to GPT, create a simple volume, and finally NTFS format using a combination of diskpart, Device Manager, and EaseUS' Partition Master Pro. Assuming that 4K alignment would be like MBR-->GPT conversion, I just pulled that drive off the shelf and plugged it in. Then started Partition Master and, using the 4K alignment app in Tools, started the process. It ran about 24 hours, but did finish. Happy sleuthing.
 

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What was the diskpart/partition offset for that drive, Tony?


IMG_4939.png
 

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I hadn't checked. Actually, didn't know how to do that until I read your previous post. :-)

EDIT: Although it is now 16MB! What?!
 

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TonyCzar said:
EDIT: Although it is now 16MB! What?!
Click to expand...

What does it say when you right click>properties in File Explorer?

Can you screenshoot the Diskpart window?
 

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TonyCzar said:
EaseUS' Partition Master Pro
Click to expand...

What does it say in there?

At a guess… there is a 16MB partition and the rest is unallocated? I don’t know.

In Diskpart, are you selecting the correct disk?
 

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Screenshot (19).pngScreenshot (20).png
 

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Kind of looks normal to me, Tony. Disk 2 is the external??
I have 2 (I think) non OS HDD’s that were given a small reserved partition after formatting or changing to GPT (I can’t remeber which)
But the main partition (partition 2) on disk 2 that you show is the usable space.

I am not qualified to inform, Tony.
 

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    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
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    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
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    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
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    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
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    M.2 512GB
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OH, sorry, you mean the offset. let me look into that…
 

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    Gigabyte nVidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super OC 6GB
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    5 x LG 25MS500-B - 1 x 24MK430H-B - 1 x Wacom Pro 22" Tablet
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    OS on Samsung 1TB 870 QVO SATA
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    Intel Core 12th Gen i5-1240P Processor (1.7 - 4.4GHz)
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
    Sound Card
    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
    Screen Resolution
    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
    Hard Drives
    M.2 512GB
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Again, I am not qualified.
This is something I found.

The bottom line is to always have fdisk set the initial offset at a correct power of 2, but that is not always the case. I think the magic number was to always skip the first 16MB of a LUN. I don't have any ticket notes in front of me, but the way I remember was that a partition on the LUN could always "just worktm" by using a power-of-two offset of 16MB. That particular offset just happens to work for most of the SANs out there who are doing 1MB, 128K, 8MB chunks, or whatever... they are always power-of-two at the SAN side. So set the initial offset at 16MB, then you can have your partition blocks be whatever block size that is smaller or the same as the SAN stripe/chunk.
Click to expand...
 

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    5 x LG 25MS500-B - 1 x 24MK430H-B - 1 x Wacom Pro 22" Tablet
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    OS on Samsung 1TB 870 QVO SATA
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    Silverstone 1500
    Case
    NZXT Phantom 820 Full-Tower Case
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    Noctua NH-D15 Elite Class Dual Tower CPU Cooler / 6 x EziDIY 120mm / 2 x Corsair 140mm somethings / 1 x 140mm Thermaltake something / 2 x 200mm Corsair.
    Keyboard
    Corsair K95 / Logitech diNovo Edge Wireless
    Mouse
    Logitech: G402 / G502 / Mx Masters / MX Air Cordless
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    1000/400Mbps
    Browser
    All sorts
    Antivirus
    Kaspersky Premium
    Other Info
    I’m on a horse.
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build: 22631.4249
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LENOVO Yoga 7i EVO OLED 14" Touchscreen i5 12 Core 16GB/512GB
    CPU
    Intel Core 12th Gen i5-1240P Processor (1.7 - 4.4GHz)
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
    Sound Card
    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
    Screen Resolution
    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
    Hard Drives
    M.2 512GB
    Antivirus
    Defender / Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    …still on a horse.
Thank you. I've already subjected that HDD to Clean All.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win 11 Pro 24H2 (26100.4484)
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    This laptop is an HP 840
    CPU
    i7-1360p 2.20 GHz
    Motherboard
    HP Model 8B41 KBC Version 51.40.00
    Memory
    32 GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel® Iris® Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek High Definition Audio; Intel® Smart Sound Technology for Bluetooth® Audio; Intel® Smart Sound Technology for USB Audio Intel® Smart Sound Technology for Digital Microphones
    Monitor(s) Displays
    as outfitted
    Screen Resolution
    1920 x 1200 (as recommended)
    Hard Drives
    (1) one SSD 1TB; (2) external Samsung Portable SSD T7 Shield 4 TB
    Case
    N/A
    Cooling
    as outfitted
    Keyboard
    integrated
    Mouse
    integrated touchpad
    Internet Speed
    800MB/sec up & down
    Browser
    Chrome
    Antivirus
    Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    Device name REC-840
    Processor 13th Gen Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-1360P 2.20 GHz
    Installed RAM 32.0 GB (31.6 GB usable)
    Product ID 00355-61334-62672-AAOEM
    System type 64-bit operating system, x64-based processor
    Pen and touch Touch support with 10 touch points
  • Operating System
    Win 11 Pro 24H2 (26100.4484)
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    HP Elite Tower 800 G9 Desktop PC (7E5P9AV)
    CPU
    Intel i7 (14th generation)
    Motherboard
    8AC1 KBC Version 12.03.39
    Memory
    64 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    (1) Intel UHD Graphics 770 (integrated); (2) Intel Arc B580 graphics card
    Sound Card
    Topping E30 II DAC Preamp Audio Decoder running @ 384.0 kHz
    Monitor(s) Displays
    ASUS ProArt Display PA279CV
    Screen Resolution
    3840 x 2160
    Hard Drives
    (1) Samsung SSD 990 PRO with Heatsink 2TB; (2) internal HHD CT2000BX500SSD1 2 TB; (3) external Samsung Portable SSD T7 Shield 4 TB
    Case
    HP Elite Tower 800
    Cooling
    As God dictates the room temperature
    Keyboard
    HHKB Lite 2
    Mouse
    Microsoft wheel mouse
    Internet Speed
    800MB/sec up & down
    Browser
    Chrome
    Antivirus
    Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    BIOS U01 Ver. 02.18.10
So, @TonyCzar , this is what I did.
The external USB3 HDD enclosure arrived.
  • Minitools convert from MBR to GPT - 5 seconds

To change the cluster size to 4096 (The alleged preference for 4K alignment), the HDD needs to be formatted as exFat.​
I couldn't work out how and I actually don't think it is possible to have a cluster size of 4096 on an NTFS HDD​
​
exFat isn’t the greatest format for a HDD in any way shape or form.​
​
  • Format HDD as exFat with 4096 cluster size 5 seconds

Win-1251.png


  • The desired Offset (apparently) in diskpart should read 1024 KB. However I did read on one page out of many that it should read 32kb which is confusing.
  • With a first physical sector of 2048. Too much math and too confusing for my aging scattered brain. Does not compute.

Win-1252.png

  • Minitools Disk Properties:

Win-1249.pngWin-1250.png

  • We're looking for the "Partition Starting Offset" value in System information:
    • System Information>Components>Storage>Disks
    • This value needs to be able to be divided by 4096, the result shouldn't have decimal values.

  • System information reads as follows.
Win-1253.png


  • 1,048,576 / 4096 = 256

  • As far as I understand it, this disk is now aligned.

I took it to a neighbors across the road, he has EaseUS
In tools I looked to 4K align this drive and the partition manager told me that it was already aligned:

Screenshot 2024-09-14 151655.png

I can not for the life of me work out why your HDD took 24 hours.
It took me all of two actions at 5 seconds each.

The thing is though, I have no idea if any of this is actually correct :p


OH... and just because you did:

It's a WD Green Power WD5000AACS 7200 rpm from 2012
Obviously poor.

Win-1254.png

Yes, I also forgot to do a before read.
 
Last edited:

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build 22631.5472
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Sin-built
    CPU
    Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4770K CPU @ 3.50GHz (4th Gen?)
    Motherboard
    ASUS ROG Maximus VI Formula
    Memory
    32.0 GB of I forget and the box is in storage.
    Graphics Card(s)
    Gigabyte nVidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super OC 6GB
    Sound Card
    Onboard
    Monitor(s) Displays
    5 x LG 25MS500-B - 1 x 24MK430H-B - 1 x Wacom Pro 22" Tablet
    Screen Resolution
    All over the place
    Hard Drives
    Too many to list.
    OS on Samsung 1TB 870 QVO SATA
    PSU
    Silverstone 1500
    Case
    NZXT Phantom 820 Full-Tower Case
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 Elite Class Dual Tower CPU Cooler / 6 x EziDIY 120mm / 2 x Corsair 140mm somethings / 1 x 140mm Thermaltake something / 2 x 200mm Corsair.
    Keyboard
    Corsair K95 / Logitech diNovo Edge Wireless
    Mouse
    Logitech: G402 / G502 / Mx Masters / MX Air Cordless
    Internet Speed
    1000/400Mbps
    Browser
    All sorts
    Antivirus
    Kaspersky Premium
    Other Info
    I’m on a horse.
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build: 22631.4249
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LENOVO Yoga 7i EVO OLED 14" Touchscreen i5 12 Core 16GB/512GB
    CPU
    Intel Core 12th Gen i5-1240P Processor (1.7 - 4.4GHz)
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
    Sound Card
    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
    Screen Resolution
    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
    Hard Drives
    M.2 512GB
    Antivirus
    Defender / Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    …still on a horse.
antspants said:
I took it to a neighbors across the road, he has EaseUS
In tools I looked to 4K align this drive and the partition manager told me that it was already aligned:

View attachment 108583

I can not for the life of me work out why your HDD took 24 hours.
It took me all of two actions at 5 seconds each.

The thing is though, I have no idea if any of this is actually correct :p
Click to expand...

what version of EaseUS was this?
I guess I have an old version of EaseUS that does "not" have the 4K alignment option available
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    windows 10 ltsc
erpster4 said:
what version of EaseUS was this?
I guess I have an old version of EaseUS that does "not" have the 4K alignment option available
Click to expand...
I didnt look. The OP uses it, I had to go across the road to try it.

I came to the conclusion in the end that 4k alignment is pointless. There are too many catch 22’s
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build 22631.5472
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Sin-built
    CPU
    Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4770K CPU @ 3.50GHz (4th Gen?)
    Motherboard
    ASUS ROG Maximus VI Formula
    Memory
    32.0 GB of I forget and the box is in storage.
    Graphics Card(s)
    Gigabyte nVidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super OC 6GB
    Sound Card
    Onboard
    Monitor(s) Displays
    5 x LG 25MS500-B - 1 x 24MK430H-B - 1 x Wacom Pro 22" Tablet
    Screen Resolution
    All over the place
    Hard Drives
    Too many to list.
    OS on Samsung 1TB 870 QVO SATA
    PSU
    Silverstone 1500
    Case
    NZXT Phantom 820 Full-Tower Case
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 Elite Class Dual Tower CPU Cooler / 6 x EziDIY 120mm / 2 x Corsair 140mm somethings / 1 x 140mm Thermaltake something / 2 x 200mm Corsair.
    Keyboard
    Corsair K95 / Logitech diNovo Edge Wireless
    Mouse
    Logitech: G402 / G502 / Mx Masters / MX Air Cordless
    Internet Speed
    1000/400Mbps
    Browser
    All sorts
    Antivirus
    Kaspersky Premium
    Other Info
    I’m on a horse.
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build: 22631.4249
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LENOVO Yoga 7i EVO OLED 14" Touchscreen i5 12 Core 16GB/512GB
    CPU
    Intel Core 12th Gen i5-1240P Processor (1.7 - 4.4GHz)
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
    Sound Card
    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
    Screen Resolution
    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
    Hard Drives
    M.2 512GB
    Antivirus
    Defender / Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    …still on a horse.
What everyone's missing is the drive manufacturers fixed this problem back in 2011, by agreeing to an industry standard where factory delivered drives are pre-aligned to the 4K boundary.

Disk utilities still support the 4K check because you might have a legacy HDD hiding in your closet that was formatted the old way.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 7
I dont think im missing anything.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build 22631.5472
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Sin-built
    CPU
    Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4770K CPU @ 3.50GHz (4th Gen?)
    Motherboard
    ASUS ROG Maximus VI Formula
    Memory
    32.0 GB of I forget and the box is in storage.
    Graphics Card(s)
    Gigabyte nVidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super OC 6GB
    Sound Card
    Onboard
    Monitor(s) Displays
    5 x LG 25MS500-B - 1 x 24MK430H-B - 1 x Wacom Pro 22" Tablet
    Screen Resolution
    All over the place
    Hard Drives
    Too many to list.
    OS on Samsung 1TB 870 QVO SATA
    PSU
    Silverstone 1500
    Case
    NZXT Phantom 820 Full-Tower Case
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 Elite Class Dual Tower CPU Cooler / 6 x EziDIY 120mm / 2 x Corsair 140mm somethings / 1 x 140mm Thermaltake something / 2 x 200mm Corsair.
    Keyboard
    Corsair K95 / Logitech diNovo Edge Wireless
    Mouse
    Logitech: G402 / G502 / Mx Masters / MX Air Cordless
    Internet Speed
    1000/400Mbps
    Browser
    All sorts
    Antivirus
    Kaspersky Premium
    Other Info
    I’m on a horse.
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build: 22631.4249
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LENOVO Yoga 7i EVO OLED 14" Touchscreen i5 12 Core 16GB/512GB
    CPU
    Intel Core 12th Gen i5-1240P Processor (1.7 - 4.4GHz)
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
    Sound Card
    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
    Screen Resolution
    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
    Hard Drives
    M.2 512GB
    Antivirus
    Defender / Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    …still on a horse.
Interesting topic.

My system: Is this how Windows partitions the drive up?

1727506515956.png
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Win 11 Pro Workstation 24H2 26100.4484
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Manmade
    CPU
    Xeon W7-3455
    Motherboard
    Gigabyte MW83-RP0
    Memory
    256Gb
    Graphics Card(s)
    RTX 4500 ADA
    Sound Card
    RealTek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    LG 32UN650P
    Screen Resolution
    3840x2160
    Hard Drives
    Boot: Transcend TS1MTE250H. Storage: Sabrent SB-RKT4P. Backup: Toshiba MG08ADA600E
    PSU
    Corsair 850W
    Case
    BeQuiet 802
    Cooling
    Noctua D9
    Internet Speed
    51Mb
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Defender
    Other Info
    24H2 26100.4484
MrPig said:
Interesting topic.

My system: Is this how Windows partitions the drive up?

View attachment 110241
Click to expand...



Welcome to the Rabbit Hole

Partition Alignment detailed explanation - Thomas-Krenn-Wiki-en

Partition alignment is understood to mean the proper alignment of partitions to the reasonable boundaries of a data storage device (such as a hard disk, solid-state drive (SSD) or RAID volume). Proper partition alignment ensures ideal performance during data access. Incorrect partition alignment...
www.thomas-krenn.com www.thomas-krenn.com
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build 22631.5472
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Sin-built
    CPU
    Intel(R) Core(TM) i7-4770K CPU @ 3.50GHz (4th Gen?)
    Motherboard
    ASUS ROG Maximus VI Formula
    Memory
    32.0 GB of I forget and the box is in storage.
    Graphics Card(s)
    Gigabyte nVidia GeForce GTX 1660 Super OC 6GB
    Sound Card
    Onboard
    Monitor(s) Displays
    5 x LG 25MS500-B - 1 x 24MK430H-B - 1 x Wacom Pro 22" Tablet
    Screen Resolution
    All over the place
    Hard Drives
    Too many to list.
    OS on Samsung 1TB 870 QVO SATA
    PSU
    Silverstone 1500
    Case
    NZXT Phantom 820 Full-Tower Case
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 Elite Class Dual Tower CPU Cooler / 6 x EziDIY 120mm / 2 x Corsair 140mm somethings / 1 x 140mm Thermaltake something / 2 x 200mm Corsair.
    Keyboard
    Corsair K95 / Logitech diNovo Edge Wireless
    Mouse
    Logitech: G402 / G502 / Mx Masters / MX Air Cordless
    Internet Speed
    1000/400Mbps
    Browser
    All sorts
    Antivirus
    Kaspersky Premium
    Other Info
    I’m on a horse.
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 Build: 22631.4249
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LENOVO Yoga 7i EVO OLED 14" Touchscreen i5 12 Core 16GB/512GB
    CPU
    Intel Core 12th Gen i5-1240P Processor (1.7 - 4.4GHz)
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR5 RAM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics Processor
    Sound Card
    Optimized with Dolby Atmos®
    Screen Resolution
    QHD 2880 x 1800 OLED
    Hard Drives
    M.2 512GB
    Antivirus
    Defender / Malwarebytes
    Other Info
    …still on a horse.

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Win 11 Pro Workstation 24H2 26100.4484
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Manmade
    CPU
    Xeon W7-3455
    Motherboard
    Gigabyte MW83-RP0
    Memory
    256Gb
    Graphics Card(s)
    RTX 4500 ADA
    Sound Card
    RealTek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    LG 32UN650P
    Screen Resolution
    3840x2160
    Hard Drives
    Boot: Transcend TS1MTE250H. Storage: Sabrent SB-RKT4P. Backup: Toshiba MG08ADA600E
    PSU
    Corsair 850W
    Case
    BeQuiet 802
    Cooling
    Noctua D9
    Internet Speed
    51Mb
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Defender
    Other Info
    24H2 26100.4484
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