Announcing general availability of Windows 365 for Windows 10 and Windows 11

jimbo45 · Aug 4, 2021

Kari said:
I'll do my best and try to explain this to you.

The most important factor, and I believe which will be most deciding factor for quite a number of small entrepeneurs, is that your device does not have to be anything special. Having your Windows 365 PC in cloud, you can just grab your cheap $99 Android tablet or a second hand iPad Mini when going to a gig. With that tablet, or an iPhone or a Samsung Android phone, you have full access to a full, complete Windows 10 / 11 as soon as you open a browser.

The specs of your device are not important, because all bit crunching is done in the cloud, on Windows 365 Cloud PC. You can access and use it from any device, just using a browser. After a day's work, the plumber or electrician or whatnot returns home, and opens Windows 365 Cloud PC in Chrome in his 15 year old "ready to retire" old Pentium PC, and checks today's notes, writes bills, orders parts for customers, and so on. It's compeletely, profoundly irrelevant, that the PC he's using cannot be upgraded beyond Windows Vista.

Notable here is, that it will be as fast and easy to him, than to a colleague using a physical installation of Windows on a last generation monster PC. Any device, any time, never needing to shut down. Just open a browser and sign in to Windows 365 Cloud PC, it's there as you left it after your last visit.

In my opinion, Windows 365 Cloud PC will be a game changer, best thing happening in Windows world since launch of Windows 10. Thinking about private web designers, architects, IT consults, plumbers, electricians, real estate agents, and so on, people often on the road meeting customers, it just makes life and work much easier.

Of course I understand, that especially coming from me, you will have counter arguments. That's OK. Let's just agree about the fact, that although Windows 365 Cloud PC is a good thing, you do not like it.

Kari

In some ways I'd agree - but the whole thing depends on how it's priced - if it's too expensive then a lot of the potential market won't use it. As I mentioned previously a HUGE market would be schools (and possibly Uni's). Schools particularly as it wouldn't matter what type of device the pupils have as the infrastructure etc is all done in the cloud as well as better security and everybody would have the same OS etc. Although typical schools I'd imagine wouldn't even be able to dream of paying around 140 EUR a month per seat -- for a 2,000 roll school that could be 280,000 EUR a month for a decent configuration. !! Not payable even in wishful dreams on typical School budgets. Ms will have to come up with better deals.

Funny though - I think about 18 Months ago on W10 Forums when the whole idea of a Windows Subscription service was mooted how many people (the vast majority in fact) said Ms would never go down this route -- now not only is it doing exactly this with a vengeance it seems to be within limitations quite a popular idea. !!

Cheers
jimbo

Haydon · Aug 4, 2021

Point-of-sales are definitely attractive for the $20/user/month edition of Windows 365.

Sure, Microsoft has stated that at the present time Windows 365 is for single users, but that does not have to remain that way for all eternity, though. How about $20/teacher/month for a teacher with 20 students?

Or $99/family of 6/year? That's what I am hoping for the consumer edition of Windows 365

Haydon · Aug 4, 2021

Ghot said:
In the past 20 years, my computer has been "hacked" never.
I wonder how many Cloud setups have been hacked... this month.

True that! In 2013, Adobe was hacked and 38 million user accounts were exposed. It was probably an insider job, and if it can happen to Adobe, it can happen to MS too. My account was one of those 38 millions. I never felt any adverse effects, but it made me paranoid at the time, although that has worn off. Time for a refresher, thanks!

Just trying to go through the pros and cons in a dispassionate way.

waltc · Aug 4, 2021

I find this unappealing, myself--well, I have no need of Office these days. I've heard of "Office 365" but this is the first I've heard of "Windows 365"--unless Microsoft is adding Office 365 to the Windows builds, upping the price, and hoping no one notices... :wink:

I think I'll pass atm.

mjh312 · Aug 4, 2021

Reminds me of the ~~good~~ bad old days when I lugged around a typewriter-like device with big cups for a phone handset, or a monitor and keyboard with a modem, to connect to the company mainframe from whereever there was a phone. Thankfully smart phones, tablets, and laptops are a lot smaller now, and phone connection can be wireless. But I feel sure the desire for everything being in one's own device with no need to connect (except perhaps to sync periodically) will continue to be a significant demand. And I still personally prefer purchasing, not renting, most of my software. Different strokes ...

Haydon · Aug 4, 2021

Kari said:
In my opinion, Windows 365 Cloud PC will be a game changer, best thing happening in Windows world since launch of Windows 10. Thinking about private web designers, architects, IT consults, plumbers, electricians, real estate agents, and so on, people often on the road meeting customers, it just makes life and work much easier.

There will be differentiation. A web designer, who works with Photoshop, can easily need 10x more Windows 365 than the point-of-sale guy. Or 100x or even more. My guess is that the web designer stays on 'earth'. Others with less (or minimal) processing needs may want to hop on the cloud.

FWIW, from what I have seen so far, I like Windows 365 (because it suits my needs) just that the current business editions is too much $$

Winuser · Aug 4, 2021

Kari said:
I'll do my best and try to explain this to you.

The most important factor, and I believe which will be most deciding factor for quite a number of small entrepeneurs, is that your device does not have to be anything special. Having your Windows 365 PC in cloud, you can just grab your cheap $99 Android tablet or a second hand iPad Mini when going to a gig. With that tablet, or an iPhone or a Samsung Android phone, you have full access to a full, complete Windows 10 / 11 as soon as you open a browser.

The specs of your device are not important, because all bit crunching is done in the cloud, on Windows 365 Cloud PC. You can access and use it from any device, just using a browser. After a day's work, the plumber or electrician or whatnot returns home, and opens Windows 365 Cloud PC in Chrome in his 15 year old "ready to retire" old Pentium PC, and checks today's notes, writes bills, orders parts for customers, and so on. It's compeletely, profoundly irrelevant, that the PC he's using cannot be upgraded beyond Windows Vista.

Notable here is, that it will be as fast and easy to him, than to a colleague using a physical installation of Windows on a last generation monster PC. Any device, any time, never needing to shut down. Just open a browser and sign in to Windows 365 Cloud PC, it's there as you left it after your last visit.

In my opinion, Windows 365 Cloud PC will be a game changer, best thing happening in Windows world since launch of Windows 10. Thinking about private web designers, architects, IT consults, plumbers, electricians, real estate agents, and so on, people often on the road meeting customers, it just makes life and work much easier.

Of course I understand, that especially coming from me, you will have counter arguments. That's OK. Let's just agree about the fact, that although Windows 365 Cloud PC is a good thing, you do not like it.

Kari

You are correct about one thing. I do have a counter argument. Number 1. I hope that a successful plumber, electrician and the like are not still using ancient hardware still running Vista. Number 2. You explained what can be done with cloud computing. You did not explain why they would need the extra computing power and couldn't just use a normal computer, laptop, tablet or a smart phone. Number 3. The last major job we had done was a new heating system and guess what. They did the paper work by hand. I have never, I repeat never had any repairman come to my home and had to use any computing device to do the repairs we needed. The work orders and/or the billing was always done with paper and pen.

jimbo45 · Aug 4, 2021

Winuser said:
You are correct about one thing. I do have a counter argument. Number 1. I hope that a successful plumber, electrician and the like are not still using ancient hardware still running Vista. Number 2. You explained what can be done with cloud computing. You did not explain why they would need the extra computing power and couldn't just use a normal computer, laptop, tablet or a smart phone. Number 3. The last major job we had done was a new heating system and guess what. They did the paper work by hand. I have never, I repeat never had any repairman come to my home and had to use any computing device to do the repairs we needed. The work orders and/or the billing was always done with paper and pen.

Hi there

@Winuser
Plenty of reasons for not wanting / liking the cloud but your argument in this case doesn't actually work.

Not sure how you get repairs done where you are but unless it's a bog standard relatively simple job the relevant spares aren't always carried out on ist visit. Even simple things like Washing machines / dish washers from the same company have about 10 zillion spare parts !!!

Maybe modern appliances could have some sort of internal chip in them so when they break down it should be possible to get details of the failing parts before the engineer arrives but seems domestic appliances haven't gone down very far in this road yet inspite of all this "Internet of things" talk.

I needed some heavy duty electrical repairs recently -- the parts aren't always things carried in the workmen's vans. Often a Computer is used (usually the rugged panasonic type designed for heavy duty out in the field ) to identify and source hard to get / obscure spare parts etc. Repairman sends image to central server which sources relevant part. I agree that a computer is usually not necessary for the workman to actually do the repair but there's nothing unusual about workmen using computers on the job for billing, other documentation about the item, time spent on job etc etc - and this could be connected via the cloud or otherwise.

In fact computerised billing is preferable in some jurisdictions as "paper billing" can often lead to Tax avoidance issues --I'm sure you've had workmen from time to time that you've just paid via "Cash",

Cheers
jimbo

Winuser · Aug 4, 2021

I just had another thought. What if the customer lives in area with no internet except for dialup and also lives in a area with little to no cell phone service. I live in a area were cell phone reception is hit and miss.

Winuser · Aug 4, 2021

jimbo45 said:
Hi there

@Winuser
Plenty of reasons for not wanting / liking the cloud but your argument in this case doesn't actually work.

Not sure how you get repairs done where you are but unless it's a bog standard relatively simple job the relevant spares aren't always carried out on ist visit. Even simple things like Washing machines / dish washers from the same company have about 10 zillion spare parts !!!

Maybe modern appliances could have some sort of internal chip in them so when they break down it should be possible to get details of the failing parts before the engineer arrives but seems domestic appliances haven't gone down very far in this road yet inspite of all this "Internet of things" talk.

I needed some heavy duty electrical repairs recently -- the parts aren't always things carried in the workmen's vans. Often a Computer is used (usually the rugged panasonic type designed for heavy duty out in the field ) to identify and source hard to get / obscure spare parts etc. Repairman sends image to central server which sources relevant part. I agree that a computer is usually not necessary for the workman to actually do the repair but there's nothing unusual about workmen using computers on the job for billing, other documentation about the item, time spent on job etc etc - and this could be connected via the cloud or otherwise.

In fact computerised billing is preferable in some jurisdictions as "paper billing" can often lead to Tax avoidance issues --I'm sure you've had workmen from time to time that you've just paid via "Cash",

Cheers
jimbo

All that can be done with internet access. No extra computing power is needed.

Edit. Your example of schools is a excellent example of a practical use for cloud computing. No one will convince me that the repairman that shows up at my house needs the extra computing power that cloud computing can provide.

Edwin · Aug 4, 2021

Clever way for MS to make a few extra bucks!

Winuser · Aug 4, 2021

Edwin said:
Clever way for MS to make a few extra bucks!

I'm still waiting for proof that the repairman that come to my house needs cloud computing to do their job. None of the reply's I have received shows me the need for cloud computing. They just show the possible need for internet access.

Haydon · Aug 5, 2021

The cloud PC could show the plumber his schedule for the day, show him on his local screen his driving directions, name of the customer, what the job is all about, any special concerns that the customer expressed when he placed the order, the plumber could relay back any problems he encountered on the job that may justify any additional charges, any special parts he would need to complete the job, when that special part would be available, reconcile that with his future schedule to inform the customer when he can come back, get the agreement for the second visit, update his future schedule, bill the customer (with a portable printer), automatically update his bookkeeping in the cloud, his bookkeeping keeps track of customer payments, his bookkeeping automatically sends out payment reminders, maintains the parts inventory in his van, automatically orders parts when inventory numbers dip below a threshold, do the stats to minimize the inventory in his van while maximizing the versatility of the inventory in his van, the cloud PC downloads weekly account statements from his bank, produce weekly reports about all aspects of his business, etc. etc.

A cloud PC can integrate all the bits and pieces and therefore automates, simplifies and optimizes his business. I am positive that there is already specialized software for plumbers, electricians, etc. that runs on 'earth' computers providing some or even a high degree of integration. With the cloud PC the integration can be even more comprehensive, including GPS and/or other location services, hours in which he is entitled or not entitled to charge overtime according to local laws and automatically adjusts his bookkeeping on the fly so that he can provide cost estimates on the fly, holidays with emergency hours, weather and traffic warnings, banking, data bases of parts suppliers, etc. etc. just about everything that he needs to run his business for the day, week, month and year, in the spirit of Windows 365. And all that requires only minimal computing resources in the cloud PC.

BTW, the plumber does not even have that dilapidated decades old pentium computer anymore, he trashed that computer long ago, because he could never find the start button. The plumber only has a phone that he also uses to maintain his social life, and a portable printer. I should say, that the plumber has a happy social life and a much bigger boat than you and I have.

Edit: I am not a plumber, and I don't really know how to leverage the value propositions of cloud computing for a plumbing business. But the developers of that business automation software for plumbers might/should know, and they could/should maintain that software on the cloud PC 24/7/365 in a way that is transparent to the plumber. Kind of how your doctor keeps you healthy, and you don't really understand how he managed to heal your infected appendix.

Similarly, you don't have to know the ins and outs of cloud computing, but if you really can't see how you can leverage the value propositions of cloud computing for your own computing needs, then cloud computing cannot provide you with any value. Kind of what Henry Ford once said about self-fulfilling prophecies, think you can, think you can't, you are right either way (or something like that)

Winuser · Aug 5, 2021

Haydon said:
The cloud PC could show the plumber his schedule for the day, show him on his local screen his driving directions, name of the customer, what the job is all about, any special concerns that the customer expressed when he placed the order, the plumber could relay back any problems he encountered on the job that may justify any additional charges, any special parts he would need to complete the job, when that special part would be available, reconcile that with his future schedule to inform the customer when he can come back, get the agreement for the second visit, update his future schedule, bill the customer (with a portable printer), automatically update his bookkeeping in the cloud, his bookkeeping keeps track of customer payments, his bookkeeping automatically sends out payment reminders, maintains the parts inventory in his van, automatically orders parts when inventory numbers dip below a threshold, do the stats to minimize the inventory in his van while maximizing the versatility of the inventory in his van, the cloud PC downloads weekly account statements from his bank, produce weekly reports about all aspects of his business, etc. etc.

A cloud PC can integrate all the bits and pieces and therefore automates, simplifies and optimizes his business. I am positive that there is already specialized software for plumbers, electricians, etc. that runs on 'earth' computers providing some or even a high degree of integration. With the cloud PC the integration can be even more comprehensive, including GPS and/or other location services, hours in which he is entitled or not entitled to charge overtime according to local laws and automatically adjusts his bookkeeping on the fly so that he can provide cost estimates on the fly, holidays with emergency hours, weather and traffic warnings, banking, data bases of parts suppliers, etc. etc. just about everything that he needs to run his business for the day, week, month and year, in the spirit of Windows 365. And all that requires only minimal computing resources in the cloud PC.

BTW, the plumber does not even have that dilapidated decades old pentium computer anymore, he trashed that computer long ago, because he could never find the start button. The plumber only has a phone that he also uses to maintain his social life, and a portable printer. I should say, that the plumber has a happy social life and a much bigger boat than you and I have.

Edit: I am not a plumber, and I don't really know how to leverage the value propositions of cloud computing for a plumbing business. But the developers of that business automation software for plumbers might/should know, and they could/should maintain that software on the cloud PC 24/7/365 in a way that is transparent to the plumber. Kind of how your doctor keeps you healthy, and you don't really understand how he managed to heal your infected appendix.

Similarly, you don't have to know the ins and outs of cloud computing, but if you really can't see how you can leverage the value propositions of cloud computing for your own computing needs, then cloud computing cannot provide you with any value. Kind of what Henry Ford once said about self-fulfilling prophecies, think you can, think you can't, you are right either way (or something like that)

I never said that the repairman couldn't use cloud computing. I'm saying that there is no reason that they have to use cloud computing. Everything mentioned can be done with just about any computer device and internet access. I do agree with jimbo45 and how it would benefit places such as schools.

johnlgalt · Aug 5, 2021

So, you want every device out in the field to connect to the plumbing company's on-site server that contains all of that information, correct?

The issue here seems to be that you have some misconceptions on what cloud is and how it works. We're not talking about Google Drive for Desktop or OneDrive here.

Here is a good PDF primer on Cloud computing: http://www.sfisaca.org/images/Cloud Computing Primer.pdf

Here is a good link to a Medium post about Cloud Computing: A Primer on Cloud Computing

And finally here is a link that goes into more details about what it is and how it works and what are the benefits of it: What is Cloud Computing? Everything You Need to Know

With Cloud Computing, Mr. Plumberman doesn't have to pay out tens of thousands of dollars to an IT firm to maintain a server on his premises so his techs know where to go when, and have access to historical data on any given customer, maintain inventory, schedule repair services, etc. - he can focus on having it done and pushed out to everyone because he uses his Internet connection to make the changes in the clod, and everyone else uses their own connection to get the information that they need.

In a self-hosted situation, everyone would be using the plumberman's company internet every time they need an update / make an update / close a ticket - because Mr. Plumberman's building is where the server is. So, now, in addition to an IT firm for maintaining the server, he has to have a much better, reliable, internet connection that costs a lot more, to make sure his employees can get their updates, close their tickets, etc.

Anyone who thinks that a business, and particularly small and medium sized business (SMBs) doesn't NEED the cloud, is correct. They can do it all on their own.

But it is a hell of a lot more expensive, time and resource intensive, and much, much hard to scale with needs, than by using cloud. So, if Mr. Plumberman wants to focus on getting a better reputation in his area by having better reviews because of better scheduling, faster repairs, with ready parts availability, etc. - the cloud is a great alternative.

Winuser · Aug 5, 2021

johnlgalt said:
So, you want every device out in the field to connect to the plumbing company's on-site server that contains all of that information, correct?

The issue here seems to be that you have some misconceptions on what cloud is and how it works. We're not talking about Google Drive for Desktop or OneDrive here.

Here is a good PDF primer on Cloud computing: http://www.sfisaca.org/images/Cloud Computing Primer.pdf

Here is a good link to a Medium post about Cloud Computing: A Primer on Cloud Computing

And finally here is a link that goes into more details about what it is and how it works and what are the benefits of it: What is Cloud Computing? Everything You Need to Know

With Cloud Computing, Mr. Plumberman doesn't have to pay out tens of thousands of dollars to an IT firm to maintain a server on his premises so his techs know where to go when, and have access to historical data on any given customer, maintain inventory, schedule repair services, etc. - he can focus on having it done and pushed out to everyone because he uses his Internet connection to make the changes in the clod, and everyone else uses their own connection to get the information that they need.

In a self-hosted situation, everyone would be using the plumberman's company internet every time they need an update / make an update / close a ticket - because Mr. Plumberman's building is where the server is. So, now, in addition to an IT firm for maintaining the server, he has to have a much better, reliable, internet connection that costs a lot more, to make sure his employees can get their updates, close their tickets, etc.

Anyone who thinks that a business, and particularly small and medium sized business (SMBs) doesn't NEED the cloud, is correct. They can do it all on their own.

But it is a hell of a lot more expensive, time and resource intensive, and much, much hard to scale with needs, than by using cloud. So, if Mr. Plumberman wants to focus on getting a better reputation in his area by having better reviews because of better scheduling, faster repairs, with ready parts availability, etc. - the cloud is a great alternative.

You're way over complicating things trying to sell me on why the repairmen has to have cloud computing to do their job. I'm not convinced and never will be. With this I'm done with the repairman and why they have to have cloud computing to do repairs subject.

Haydon · Aug 5, 2021

The cloud is a value proposition

not a value imposition :scream:

of course not, nothing ever is, nobody ever said that, that's not the discussion.

The discussion is about whether the value proposition is valuable enough for a plumber, school, you, I etc. to pay the published prices. Of course, there will be different opinions about that.

Obviously, I am on the side of cloud computing being a very good value proposition, but even I (and other consumers) find it too expensive (at the present time) to pay the published prices. But obviously, Microsoft marketing considers the value proposition being valuable enough for businesses to pay the published prices (there will be exceptions among businesses too, of course)

Edit: Yes, I too won't engage in further discussions whether the value proposition is valuable enough or not, etc. But I do hope that the discussion on the value proposition itself will continue. Cloud PC will come for me and other consumers, too.
Peace.

Haydon · Aug 5, 2021

OK, I'll try to restart the discussion on the value proposition of Windows 365 itself, especially on the value proposition for consumers (like myself and my household)

As a baseline for the value proposition, let's take the one man plumbing (or electrician, etc.) company again. He subscribes to Windows 365 and business automation software. Apart from the tools of the trade, he runs his business with a phone and a printer. He does not even own a computer.
Now take a lawyer in solo practice. I don't see much difference to 1, although I would expect the lawyer to have at least a cheap computer and a decent sized monitor, too. I doubt that he wants to squint at a 100 page document on his phone. The cheap computer and the decent sized monitor could be considered tools of the trade in this case.
Now take a household with up to 6 users but pays only for 1.5 X (similar to Office 365). This is consistent with what I observed in my own household and the households of my extended family, only 1 or 2 of the 6 would make actual use of Windows 365.
In an earlier post, I pointed out a teacher with 20 students who could get by with a single license for Windows 365, so this is a similar situation as 3.

The difference between 1 & 2 on the one hand, and 3 & 4 on the other hand, is that the latter does resource (and price) sharing and the former does not. The current business licenses do not allow for resource sharing (which makes good sense for businesses) The technology for doing resource sharing is multiple decades old. The hurdle towards cheap consumer prices appears to be purely in the commercial realm

johnlgalt · Aug 5, 2021

Winuser said:
You're way over complicating things trying to sell me on why the repairmen has to have cloud computing to do their job. I'm not convinced and never will be. With this I'm done with the repairman and why they have to have cloud computing to do repairs subject.

No, I'm not. You're trying to over simplify it.

I'm not trying to demean you, WinUser, but you're not grasping the concept here. And how a business owner makes use of the resources they have available for their business is their own choice. If they want they can rely on pen and paper and landlines only for all I care. But the efficiency offered by cloud, in this day and age where everything else is done on computers already, makes using Cloud services an attractive alternative to having to run all of these things (software, server, databases, etc.) on your own server equipment. It's a much lower RoI than if you do all of it yourself. It's really that simple.

Haydon said:
The cloud is a value proposition not a value imposition of course not, nothing ever is, nobody ever said that, that's not the discussion.

The discussion is about whether the value proposition is valuable enough for a plumber, school, you, I etc. to pay the published prices. Of course, there will be different opinions about that.

Obviously, I am on the side of cloud computing being a very good value proposition, but even I (and other consumers) find it too expensive (at the present time) to pay the published prices. But obviously, Microsoft marketing considers the value proposition being valuable enough for businesses to pay the published prices (there will be exceptions among businesses too, of course)

Edit: Yes, I too won't engage in further discussions whether the value proposition is valuable enough or not, etc. But I do hope that the discussion on the value proposition itself will continue. Cloud PC will come for me and other consumers, too.
Peace.

Yes. This is it exactly, and this is the discussion that needs to continue, because it is absolutely germaine to the topic.

Haydon said:
OK, I'll try to restart the discussion on the value proposition of Windows 365 itself, especially on the value proposition for consumers (like myself and my household)

As a baseline for the value proposition, let's take the one man plumbing (or electrician, etc.) company again. He subscribes to Windows 365 and business automation software. Apart from the tools of the trade, he runs his business with a phone and a printer. He does not even own a computer.

Now take a lawyer in solo practice. I don't see much difference to 1, although I would expect the lawyer to have at least a cheap computer and a decent sized monitor, too. I doubt that he wants to squint at a 100 page document on his phone. The cheap computer and the decent sized monitor could be considered tools of the trade in this case.

Now take a household with up to 6 users but pays only for 1.5 X (similar to Office 365). This is consistent with what I observed in my own household and the households of my extended family, only 1 or 2 of the 6 would make actual use of Windows 365.

In an earlier post, I pointed out a teacher with 20 students who could get by with a single license for Windows 365, so this is a similar situation as 3.

The difference between 1 & 2 on the one hand, and 3 & 4 on the other hand, is that the latter does resource (and price) sharing and the former does not. The current business licenses do not allow for resource sharing (which makes good sense for businesses) The technology for doing resource sharing is multiple decades old. The hurdle towards cheap consumer prices appears to be purely in the commercial realm

That's really not a fair argument - this Windows 365 is not aimed at consumers in any way, manner, or fashion at all.

If you go to the link it states it quite clearly in the first statement. At Windows 365 Cloud PC | Microsoft you see buttons right at the top for Windows 365 Business and Windows 365 Enterprise. Notice what you don't see? Windows 365 [B]HOME[/B].

Furthermore, from Microsoft unveils Windows 365 — ushering in a new category of computing you get this:

Windows 365 will deliver a full, personalized PC experience from the cloud to any device, giving workers and organizations power, simplicity and security for hybrid work.

It's not a consumer-focused product, any more so than Windows NT / Windows Server OSs are.

Sole proprietorships will have different needs than multi-employee businesses, which will have different needs from a multi-location business, which will have different needs from a nulti-state organization, non-profit, or corp, which will ahve differnt needs from corps and enterprises. The value proposition has to be evalauted at every step - just like with everything when it comes to running a business.

But there is little to no value of trying to use a product designed for use in business for home consumers who are not employed in any sort of business at all.

Winuser · Aug 5, 2021

johnlgalt said:
No, I'm not. You're trying to over simplify it.

I'm not trying to demean you, WinUser, but you're not grasping the concept here. And how a business owner makes use of the resources they have available for their business is their own choice. If they want they can rely on pen and paper and landlines only for all I care. But the efficiency offered by cloud, in this day and age where everything else is done on computers already, makes using Cloud services an attractive alternative to having to run all of these things (software, server, databases, etc.) on your own server equipment. It's a much lower RoI than if you do all of it yourself. It's really that simple.

Yes. This is it exactly, and this is the discussion that needs to continue, because it is absolutely germaine to the topic.

That's really not a fair argument - this Windows 365 is not aimed at consumers in any way, manner, or fashion at all.

If you go to the link it states it quite clearly in the first statement. At Windows 365 Cloud PC | Microsoft you see buttons right at the top for Windows 365 Business and Windows 365 Enterprise. Notice what you don't see? Windows 365 [B]HOME[/B].

Furthermore, from Microsoft unveils Windows 365 — ushering in a new category of computing you get this:

It's not a consumer-focused product, any more so than Windows NT / Windows Server OSs are.

Sole proprietorships will have different needs than multi-employee businesses, which will have different needs from a multi-location business, which will have different needs from a nulti-state organization, non-profit, or corp, which will ahve differnt needs from corps and enterprises. The value proposition has to be evalauted at every step - just like with everything when it comes to running a business.

But there is little to no value of trying to use a product designed for use in business for home consumers who are not employed in any sort of business at all.

OK, I'll make this my last post on the subject. For medium to large companies, Institutions and schools I will agree that using cloud computing can be very beneficial. Your local repairmen doesn't need to use cloud computing to get their repairs done. I have been told what can be done with cloud computing and it is right. I just haven't seen why the local plumbers, electricians and etc. can't get the same jobs done without cloud computing.

Edit: I won't be offended if anyone wants to put me on their ignore list because I'm not going to change my opinion about cloud computing and the repairmen needing it to do their job.