Solved Difference between Max Processor State and Max Processor Frequency


Steerpike

Active member
Local time
8:57 AM
Posts
41
OS
Windows 11 Home
I became aware of the great power settings tweaking tool 'Power Settings Explorer' ( Windows power plan settings explorer utility ). It allows you to hide/unhide, and change, many different settings related to power plan settings.

I've been aware of 'Max Processor State' for a long time; you specify it in %, from 0-100%. But through this new tool, I became aware of 'Max Processor Frequency', which you specify in Hz, from 0-<your maximum frequency>.

My question is - if I set 'max processor state' to, say, 50%, what am I actually limiting - is it affecting a voltage, a frequency, or what?

Thanks for any insight. Google doesn't seem to be helping me on this one!
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LG Gram 17 17Z95P-K.AAE8U1
    CPU
    i7-1195G7
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR4X 4266MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe (Integrated)
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1600
    Hard Drives
    512 GB M.2 NVMe SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP940X5J
    Memory
    8 Gig
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    256 GB SSD; 2 TB SSD (SATA)
May I ask why you would want to? What are you trying to accomplish? Underpowering a cpu will affect performance, at 50% it will be greatly affected. For overall balance of performance vs power consumption, you should use the balanced power plan.

If your aim is to reduce heat, the i7-1065G7 gives the option in bios to disable hyperthreading. Without hyperthreading, your processor gets one program per core at a time. Hyperthreading means you can get multiple programs per CPU, which allows you to basically turn each core into two processors. Your particular CPU has 4 cores and 8 threads.
If you use you laptop for nothing more than email and web browsing, disabling hyperthreading probably would not affect its overall performance. However, if you use applications requiring more processing power, you would notice performance loss.

That particular cpu is a power efficient cpu in the first place, averaging only 15W. IMO, it is inadvisable to mess with its power setting.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 22631.3296
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 7080
    CPU
    i9-10900 10 core 20 threads
    Motherboard
    DELL 0J37VM
    Memory
    32 gb
    Graphics Card(s)
    none-Intel UHD Graphics 630
    Sound Card
    Integrated Realtek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    1tb Solidigm m.2 +256gb ssd+512 gb usb m.2 sata
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell Premium
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Internet Speed
    so slow I'm too embarrassed to tell
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro 22H2 19045.3930
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 9020
    CPU
    i7-4770
    Memory
    24 gb
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    256 gb Toshiba BG4 M.2 NVE SSB and 1 tb hdd
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell factory
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Internet Speed
    still not telling
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
May I ask why you would want to? What are you trying to accomplish? Underpowering a cpu will affect performance, at 50% it will be greatly affected. For overall balance of performance vs power consumption, you should use the balanced power plan.

If your aim is to reduce heat, the i7-1065G7 gives the option in bios to disable hyperthreading. Without hyperthreading, your processor gets one program per core at a time. Hyperthreading means you can get multiple programs per CPU, which allows you to basically turn each core into two processors. Your particular CPU has 4 cores and 8 threads.
If you use you laptop for nothing more than email and web browsing, disabling hyperthreading probably would not affect its overall performance. However, if you use applications requiring more processing power, you would notice performance loss.

That particular cpu is a power efficient cpu in the first place, averaging only 15W. IMO, it is inadvisable to mess with its power setting.
I'm primarily asking a question about units of measure, not computer strategy - one of the settings I mention is in units of frequency (Hz) while the other is in units of 'percentage'. I'm asking what actual, underlying physical adjustment takes place when you set a percentage below 100%; is it voltage, frequency, or something else? I used '50%' as a simple example to frame the question; I have no intention of setting it to 50%. I want to know, when I set 50%, what 'thing' is halved - the frequency, the voltage applied to the CPU, or what?

Now - as to why I would want to adjust it, there are many reasons. I personally happen to be extremely sensitive to fan noise, and I have long used that setting (max processor state) to reduce overall CPU power in order to guarantee that the fan does not kick in. Even setting it to 99% is known to disable 'turbo' mode, which will stop temperature spikes and therefore fan activity. On my last laptop I found that setting max processor state to 75% would prevent the fan from ever kicking in, while having no noticeable impact on actual, real-world perceived performance during my daily activities (browsing, spreadsheets, excel, email, quicken, etc). When I need to transcode a video or play a game, I can set it to 100% in seconds.

But now I'm aware of the 'max processor frequency' setting, I'm considering experimenting with it for similar purposes (and other purposes). But it then occurred to me - being an engineer and all - what is 'max processor state' actually adjusting?

TL;DR - what underlying physical component (frequency, voltage, etc) does 'max processor state' adjust?
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LG Gram 17 17Z95P-K.AAE8U1
    CPU
    i7-1195G7
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR4X 4266MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe (Integrated)
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1600
    Hard Drives
    512 GB M.2 NVMe SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP940X5J
    Memory
    8 Gig
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    256 GB SSD; 2 TB SSD (SATA)
I am not a hardware expert but here's the way I understand it. If I am wrong, I hope someone will correct me.

Min/Max Processor states:
These 2 options customize your clock speed. The clock speed measures the number of cycles your CPU executes per second in GHz. This basically means the speed of your cpu.
If you reduce your Max Processor State you would be using less power but sacrificing performance.
The Minimum Processor State specifies the minimum frequency the computer is running while performing minimal tasks or idling. (ie the constant speed of cpu) Changing this will vary the processor's clock speed and, if supported, voltage and FSB speed.

Intel's explanation of clock speed here CPU Speed: What Is CPU Clock Speed? | Intel
 
Last edited:

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 22631.3296
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 7080
    CPU
    i9-10900 10 core 20 threads
    Motherboard
    DELL 0J37VM
    Memory
    32 gb
    Graphics Card(s)
    none-Intel UHD Graphics 630
    Sound Card
    Integrated Realtek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    1tb Solidigm m.2 +256gb ssd+512 gb usb m.2 sata
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell Premium
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Internet Speed
    so slow I'm too embarrassed to tell
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro 22H2 19045.3930
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 9020
    CPU
    i7-4770
    Memory
    24 gb
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    256 gb Toshiba BG4 M.2 NVE SSB and 1 tb hdd
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell factory
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Internet Speed
    still not telling
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
I forgot to say that Max processor frequency specifies the operating frequency of the CPU core(s)

 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 22631.3296
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 7080
    CPU
    i9-10900 10 core 20 threads
    Motherboard
    DELL 0J37VM
    Memory
    32 gb
    Graphics Card(s)
    none-Intel UHD Graphics 630
    Sound Card
    Integrated Realtek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    1tb Solidigm m.2 +256gb ssd+512 gb usb m.2 sata
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell Premium
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Internet Speed
    so slow I'm too embarrassed to tell
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro 22H2 19045.3930
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Dell Optiplex 9020
    CPU
    i7-4770
    Memory
    24 gb
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Benq 27
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    256 gb Toshiba BG4 M.2 NVE SSB and 1 tb hdd
    PSU
    500w
    Case
    MT
    Cooling
    Dell factory
    Mouse
    Logitech wireless
    Keyboard
    Logitech wired
    Internet Speed
    still not telling
    Browser
    Firefox
    Antivirus
    Defender+MWB Premium
Just a sidenote: Hyperthreading gives only about 25% performance gain per core. This is on a good day (an app that runs code that can easily be vectorized), most often you only gain about 15% performance, if any.

In worst case scenario, your apps will run slower when HT is enabled. This happen rarely though, but is possible.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 build 10.0.22631.3296 (Release Channel) / Linux Mint 21.3 Cinnamon
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo A485
    CPU
    Ryzen 7 2700U Pro
    Motherboard
    Lenovo (WiFi/BT module upgraded to Intel Wireless-AC-9260)
    Memory
    32GB
    Graphics Card(s)
    iGPU Vega 10
    Sound Card
    Realtek
    Monitor(s) Displays
    14" FHD (built-in) + 14" Lenovo Thinkvision M14t (touch+pen) + 32" Asus PB328
    Screen Resolution
    FHD + FHD + 1440p
    Hard Drives
    Intel 660p m.2 nVME PCIe3.0 x2 512GB
    PSU
    65W
    Keyboard
    Thinkpad / Logitech MX Keys
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 2S
    Internet Speed
    600/300Mbit
    Browser
    Edge (Chromium)
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    SecureBoot: Enabled
    TPM2.0: Enabled
    AMD-V: Enabled
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Pro 23H2 build 10.0.22631.3296(Release Preview Channel)
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Custom
    CPU
    i7-7700k @4.8GHz
    Motherboard
    Asus PRIME Z270-A
    Memory
    32GB 2x16GB 2133MHz CL15
    Graphics card(s)
    EVGA GTX1080Ti FTW 11GB
    Sound Card
    Integrated
    Monitor(s) Displays
    32" 10-bit Asus PB328Q
    Screen Resolution
    WQHD 2560x1440
    Hard Drives
    512GB ADATA SX8000NP NVMe PCIe Gen 3 x4
    PSU
    850W
    Case
    Fractal Design Define 7
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 2S
    Keyboard
    Logitech MX Keys
    Internet Speed
    600/300Mbit
    Browser
    Edge (Cromium)
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    AC WiFi Card
I've been aware of 'Max Processor State' for a long time; you specify it in %, from 0-100%. But through this new tool, I became aware of 'Max Processor Frequency', which you specify in Hz, from 0-<your maximum frequency>.
According to the definition MS published in Power Policy Configuration and Deployment in Windows dated 21st October 2010, Max processor state is simply the percentage of max processor frequency i.e. these two things are not independent parameters at all.

Maximum Processor State Setting
DescriptionSpecifies the maximum processor performance state. The performance state is specified as a percentage of maximum processor frequency.
GUIDbc5038f7-23e0-4960-96da-33abaf5935ec
PowerCfg AliasPROCTHROTTLEMAX
Minimum Value0
Maximum Value100
LabelPercentage (%)
HiddenNo
Operating System VersionsAvailable in Windows Vista and later versions of Windows.
MS never updated this document & stopped making it available years ago.

There are current references in
"MaxFrequency specifies the maximum processor performance state, which is specified in Megahertz (MHz)."

If you are going to investigate these parameters using PowerCfg then note that you will need to include listing of hidden properties using the -qh switch instead of the simple -q switch.
That 2010 document also happens to be the only place I've seen the -qh switch documented.
MSPMPolicy snippet.JPG



Denis
 
Last edited:

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3296
According to the definition MS published in Power Policy Configuration and Deployment in Windows dated 21st October 2010, Max processor state is simply the percentage of max processor frequency i.e. these two things are not independent parameters at all.

Maximum Processor State Setting
DescriptionSpecifies the maximum processor performance state. The performance state is specified as a percentage of maximum processor frequency.
GUIDbc5038f7-23e0-4960-96da-33abaf5935ec
PowerCfg AliasPROCTHROTTLEMAX
Minimum Value0
Maximum Value100
LabelPercentage (%)
HiddenNo
Operating System VersionsAvailable in Windows Vista and later versions of Windows.
MS never updated this document & stopped making it available years ago.

There are current references in
"MaxFrequency specifies the maximum processor performance state, which is specified in Megahertz (MHz)."


Denis
Thanks! This is what I was looking for: "The performance state is specified as a percentage of maximum processor frequency." So the two settings just give you two ways to achieve the same end result - a reduced processor frequency. By allowing it to be specified as a %, you don't have to concern yourself with your particular processor's specific values. So really, I can see no particular value to using 'Max Processor Frequency' (which is probably why it's not well publicized).
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LG Gram 17 17Z95P-K.AAE8U1
    CPU
    i7-1195G7
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR4X 4266MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe (Integrated)
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1600
    Hard Drives
    512 GB M.2 NVMe SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP940X5J
    Memory
    8 Gig
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    256 GB SSD; 2 TB SSD (SATA)
I'm glad to be helpful.

I was still fiddling about adding a para about using PowerCfg at the end which you might not have seen.

All the best,
Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3296
I'm glad to be helpful.

I was still fiddling about adding a para about using PowerCfg at the end which you might not have seen.

All the best,
Denis
Interesting that -qh is not documented even by the tool itself, when you use -?.

Have you seen Windows power plan settings explorer utility ? It provides a very nice GUI for power settings.

1661272974633.png

As a matter of interest, I've been setting 'max power state' to values as low as 30% just to see if my battery life can be extended. I've been forced to run on battery only for a few days, and have been looking for ways to dramatically extend battery life (I know there are many other avenues for this, like screen brightness, shutting down unused apps, etc etc). What is quite interesting is, even at 30%, the 'feel' of the laptop hardly seems any different, while doing a mix of activities like browsing (40+ Edge tabs, 40+ chrome tabs), excel (5 spreadsheets open), outlook (~10 emails open), Foxit PDF, Quicken, Word, etc). Obviously if I were to try transcoding a Video, or play a game, things would be different but for the things I'm doing during the day, it's remarkably responsive still. Whether the battery life is much improved remains to be seen ...
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LG Gram 17 17Z95P-K.AAE8U1
    CPU
    i7-1195G7
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR4X 4266MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe (Integrated)
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1600
    Hard Drives
    512 GB M.2 NVMe SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP940X5J
    Memory
    8 Gig
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    256 GB SSD; 2 TB SSD (SATA)
I have not used Windows power plan settings explorer utility but have made a note of its link. Thanks.
I got used to using PowerCfg commands a decade ago with Windows 7. There are only a couple of things I change these days and I change those on-the-fly using a script [as an equivalent of having different power plans, I change specific PowerCfg parameters and, at the same time, change a WMP setting & volume level & a couple of other odds n ends]. The script detects the ComputerName and then behaves slightly differently on my different computers; this allows me to have a single script to maintain that I can just copy across to different computers.
A utility such as the one you suggested might help me during investigations though.

I don't know what sort of battery you have. On my main computer, the battery is an internal one [a design decision that I feel is flawed]. I guess you are in the same position.
- I have 19.5V powerbanks for my main computer and they use up their power before my battery starts getting used. So I use the powerbanks as sacrificial power sources to allow swapping over as they get used up.
- I also have powerbanks for my tablet-with-integrated-keyboard [that just looks like a small laptop]. This computer has an internal battery. It is my 'leisure travel' computer [well, it was until the plague started but it's had hardly any mobile use for the last two years]. It's handy having a computer so light that it & all my other things fit within airline hand baggage limits [generally 10 Kg here, about twenty two lbs] so I can just breeze in & out of airports with nothing to check in & nothing to hang around waiting for afterwards.
With my older computers, that had externally-accessible batteries, I used to buy several then [during day-long journeys] I could just hibernate for a minute to swap batteries over as they got used up. I'd prefer to be able to do that now.
So I have never seriously experimented with changing performance parameters to stretch out battery duration.

I've had several discussions about battery longevity in this forum & in TenForums. My primary concern is always to avoid unnecessarily using up my overall battery life rather than preserving its charge during individual occasions. Because of my use of powerbanks, I have a four year old battery for my main computer that still charges to 100% of its design capacity [because it's hardly ever on its own battery for more than a couple of minutes a day].

My main computer is a Dell. Its powerbanks are made by Dell.
I once tried a third-party powerbank [185Whr] but it was unreliable; it fails completely after a few weeks use. If I leave it for a month or more I can then use it again for another couple of weeks. The supplier tried to be helpful by replacing it but I think they have a design flaw because the replacement behaves in the same way as the original.
I don't know if LG or Samsung make suitable powerbanks for your computers.

All the best,
Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3296
...
I don't know what sort of battery you have. On my main computer, the battery is an internal one [a design decision that I feel is flawed]. I guess you are in the same position.
- I have 19.5V powerbanks for my main computer and they use up their power before my battery starts getting used. So I use the powerbanks as sacrificial power sources to allow swapping over as they get used up.
This new laptop (LG Gram 17) has a fixed internal battery, as is common these days, but it supports 'USB-C PD', so I finally have a laptop that can be charged with a 'powerbank' as you call it - an external rechargeable battery. I just bought one, and I'm doing exactly what you describe here - I am using the external battery in order to 'save' the internal battery. But I only have one so far, and I'm seeing just how much time I can get from the one battery pack. Between the external and the internal, I'm easily getting 'all day usage', but I would like to see if I can get a full day on the external alone.

By the way - the LG Gram 17 is under 3lbs; it is by far the lightest laptop I've ever held, and it has a massive screen (which I need). Quite an engineering feat. I wouldn't want to abuse it though; I had the Dell XPS 17 briefly before it, and that thing could withstand a nuclear blast! The LG could easily be bent if you weren't careful. But I'd rather have the relative fragility and ultra-light weight!
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    LG Gram 17 17Z95P-K.AAE8U1
    CPU
    i7-1195G7
    Memory
    16GB LPDDR4X 4266MHz
    Graphics Card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe (Integrated)
    Screen Resolution
    2560x1600
    Hard Drives
    512 GB M.2 NVMe SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 Pro
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Samsung NP940X5J
    Memory
    8 Gig
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080
    Hard Drives
    256 GB SSD; 2 TB SSD (SATA)
My main computer is a Dell Inspiron 17-7779, a 17inch laptop with a touchscreen***. It weighs 3Kg [7 lbs].
My abacus is a Chuwi Hi10 Pro with integrated keyboard, in effect a 10inch laptop with a touchscreen. It weighs 1Kg [2+ lbs]. Buying it was an experiment that paid off before the plague when I used to travel a lot. And it fits inside the 'poacher's pocket' of my jacket. It can do everything I want [MSOffice, WMP, browser] but is a bit slow.

*** My first touchscreen computer was a 7inch one over twenty years ago. I decided then that I always wanted touchscreens but it took me until six years ago to get a decent-sized [17"] touchscreen.

Denis
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Windows 11 Home x64 Version 23H2 Build 22631.3296

Latest Support Threads

Back
Top Bottom