Solved Do I Need System Restore?

NavyLCDR · Dec 22, 2023

thecaretaker said:
I'd like to see that too. Something hints that the C partition is extremely small if it can't make a restore. I'm wondering how many partitions have been created on the disk. Maybe Mitch would have been better off formatting the drive. DM should show all.

Looks like we aren't going to see the disk layout. Oh well.....

Steve C · Dec 23, 2023

I never found System Restore especially useful. I now turn it off since I use Macrium Reflect for frequent system backups.

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

Hi. Sorry to be so long in replying - battling the Christmas crowds! I am attaching 2 screenshots of Disk Management and would appreciate any advice. Thanks again.

thecaretaker · Dec 23, 2023

That looks OK. You have 2 partitions, the unlabelled 1.06gb and the unallocated 1012mb but your C drive should be OK with 474gb to run Windows. How much free space does it have when you look at 'This PC'?

dacrone · Dec 23, 2023

HowdyDo said:
How can I create a desktop shortcut for system restore? A tutorial might be good for us older folks? :)

You can also add a direct Create Restore Point to your context menu if you really want to use it..

Add Create Restore Point Context Menu in Windows 11 Tutorial

This tutorial will show you how to add or remove a Create Restore Point context menu for all users in Windows 10 and Windows 11. Turning on system protection for a drive allows System Restore to include the drive when restore points are created so you can undo undesired system changes by...

www.elevenforum.com

zebal · Dec 23, 2023

Mitch said:
vssadmin resize shadowstorage / for=C: /On=C: /maxsize=900MB

I don't think 900MB is enough, I have mine set to 12GB to have as many restore points as possible when and if I need them.

zbook · Dec 23, 2023

Mitch said:
Thanks all for taking the time to reply. I was given Cmd Prompts to try -

vssadmin list shadowstorage
vssadmin resize shadowstorage /for= /on= [/maxsize=]

When available please post the above commands with results.

Which partitions did you want to delete that were unable to be deleted?
Were they grayed or was there an error message?

vssadmin resize shadowstorage

A description of the vssadmin resize shadowstorage command, which resizes the maximum amount of storage space that can be used for shadow copy storage.

learn.microsoft.com

Troubleshoot the Azure Backup agent - Azure Backup

In this article, learn how to troubleshoot the installation and registration of the Azure Backup agent.

learn.microsoft.com

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

@thecaretaker . Thanks for replying. There is nothing on the C drive except the OS and shows 474GB free on This PC. @zbook Thanks also. What should the max size be when entering the 3rd command? Dell says 900mb which seems small. Also, when I turned on System Restore I moved the storage sliders up to near max. Should I put them back to zero (or turn off System Restore) while executing the cmds? Thanks

zbook · Dec 23, 2023

Which partitions did you want to delete that were unable to be deleted?

Were they grayed or was there an error message?

Please post share links for:

a) V2 log collector:

BSOD - Posting Instructions

BSOD - Posting Instructions This will show you how to help provide needed information about your system and dump files. It will not contain any personal or sensitive information about you or your data. To get better help with your Windows BSOD issue, please read these instructions and follow...

www.elevenforum.com

b) Event viewer log files:

How to share event logs in case of a computer issue - Your Windows Guide

This article explains How to share event logs in case of a computer issue

www.yourwindowsguide.com

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

There were 2 partitions which were greyed out when I was deleting them. There was no error message. I formatted the C drive and left the 1TB alone. The 4 partitions left were the 512GB Primary C drive, the 1 TB HDD and the 2 greyed out partitions. If I remember correctly 1 was around 12GB and the other about 1GB. Dell thinks they could be Dell installed partitions.

zbook · Dec 23, 2023

When available post share links into this thread using one drive, drop box, or google drive.

V2
event viewer
vssadmin List ShadowStorage /For=C:

(heading to bed, later in the day I'll scan the logs)

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

I ran the cmds to increase the shadow storage allocation to 3GB but the same insufficient storage error appeared. No luck.

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

I should have added in my last post that after I ran the cmds the size of the shadow storage area was successfully increased to 3GB. After running System Restore the same storage error appeared.

Dru2 · Dec 23, 2023

@Mitch,

Mitch said:
Also, when I turned on System Restore I moved the storage sliders up to near max. Should I put them back to zero (or turn off System Restore) while executing the cmds? Thanks

Understand moving the slider all the way to the "max" (the right) will use 100% percent of your storage space, and means nothing else can use that space, and why you got the error not enough storage space, as the more space used for Restore Points, the less space available for use by Windows and other apps.

I can't remember, but I think the default is around 2% percent when turned on. But it can be configured as you've done (though way too much). I myself use only 2% percent (9.5gig) on my 512gig drive, and that's plenty for me (more on that in a second). Additionally, the larger the drive the more space is used for a given percentage:

Example at 5% percent on a 512gig drive, 23.8 gig of space is reserved. On a 1TB drive that same 5% percent will reserve 46.5gig, and on a 2TB drive, it will be 93.20gig. So, the percentage reserved is based on drive size.

Now when I said for me, I'm pointing out... System Restore is NOT, repeat NOT, a backup system, it is that NOT designed for or intended to be a backup system in that it DOES NOT backup personal data (files and folders). Its job is to take a snapshot of the registry and system files to be restored prior to an event where your system becomes unstable or unresponsive. (BTW, when turned on, Windows automatically creates Restore Points in under certain trigger events such as updates or certain system changes).

Example: You install a driver or app, and the system becomes unresponsive or unstable, you can then use a Restore Point to return the PC to a state before you installed said driver or app. During the restore process it will restore the previous registry, and system files. HOWEVER, it does not affect (either way) your personal files and folders. So, say you deleted a file from your Documents folder. Using a Restore Point won't get that file back, because that's not the purpose of System Restore.

Point? if your mindset is you want System Restore enabled for "Backup" purposes, that's not what it does, and you'll be disappointed when you use it and find your personal files and data was NOT restored.

So, when I said, 10gig was good enough for me, it was based on the fact I know System Restore isn't a backup system, and therefore don't need a lot of space dedicated to System Restore. I also create manual Restore Points prior to installing certain drivers (typically GPU) and apps. Here, if an issue arises, I can immediately restore the system back to before said drivers or apps were installed. Kind or like erasing a mistake.

That said, Restore Points do not last forever, and are also overwritten as space is exhausted (thus your reserve percentage). Additionally, whenever you do a major upgrade of Windows, all the Restore Points of the previous version are wiped (deleted). Why? Because they are no longer applicable to the new version of the OS.

Sorry for the long post, but my intent is to provide a bit of info to help you make a better-informed decision on whether to use or not use, and how much to storage to allocate for System Restore.

Good luck.

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

@Dru2 Thanks for your post. My maim reason for enabling System Restore was to undo problems with Dell and Windows Updates. When a Dell driver update is installed thru Support Assist there is an option to Restore if things go wrong, not available if System Protection is turned off. Normal driver updates are not a problem, my main concern are BIOS updates. For drivers I can usually Roll Back or reinstall from Dell Drivers and Downloads. As Garioch says its just an additional layer of backup. My main safety blanket is Macrium Reflect which I use always - almost never System Restore .
If System Restore isn't working is it better to just turn it off as it was before? I'm assuming turning off System Protect won't affect Windows Updates etc? Thanks for your advice.

fixer · Dec 23, 2023

Mitch said:
Normal driver updates are not a problem, my main concern are BIOS updates.

Sorry Mitch - BIOS updates are installed outside of Windows so system restore will not revert them
.

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

Hi @fixer. Luckily I've never had a problem with BIOS updates but have to say I get apprehensive when they have to be installed. I spoke to Dell and was told that in the first instance all they would do is use cmd to increase the size of the shadow allocation. Thereafter the problem would need to he escalated to the next level. As things stand I've turned off System Protection as it has been since the clean install and rely on Macrium which has helped me out of a few issues. Thanks again.

Dru2 · Dec 23, 2023

Mitch said:
@Dru2 Thanks for your post. My maim reason for enabling System Restore was to undo problems with Dell and Windows Updates. When a Dell driver update is installed thru Support Assist there is an option to Restore if things go wrong, not available if System Protection is turned off. Normal driver updates are not a problem,

Agree, and I personally recommend it be turned on (though some will say otherwise) for those reasons.

Mitch said:
my main concern are BIOS updates. For drivers I can usually Roll Back or reinstall from Dell Drivers and Downloads. As Garioch says its just an additional layer of backup. My main safety blanket is Macrium Reflect which I use always - almost never System Restore .

I'm 99.999.9 sure System Restore isn't going to reverse BIOS updates as that's written into the BIOS' chip which System Restore does not have access to. If you're looking to reverse BIOS updates, don't look to System Restore :nope:

Mitch said:
If System Restore isn't working is it better to just turn it off as it was before?

If it's not working then, yeah, no need to turn it on... but you'll never know if it's "not working" until you try to use it when needed

Many will have negative opinions of the system, but many are based on misinformation or misunderstanding and why I wrote the long post in explaining things. And yes, NOTHING is without fault... Including Windows itself, so.... But yes, the system works when used in the manner it was designed and not as a "backup" program. It will also probably fail, it you try to do a million things to the OS, in trying to solve an issue, and THEN you decide to try and use it. My suggestion is to use it as a first resort, not a last resort after tinkering with the registry and other stuff first.

Mitch said:
I'm assuming turning off System Protect won't affect Windows Updates etc? Thanks for your advice.

No, turning off (or on) System Protection will NOT affect Windows Updates. No need to worry there.

Mitch · Dec 23, 2023

Hi @Dru2 . Thanks for the info. Was just wondering, if I can't set a manual restore point, does it also imply that an automatic restore point set by windows wouldn't also be set? Thanks

Dru2 · Dec 23, 2023

Mitch said:
Hi @Dru2 . Thanks for the info. Was just wondering, if I can't set a manual restore point, does it also imply that an automatic restore point set by windows wouldn't also be set? Thanks

Windows WILL create System Restore point at certain intervals whether you create manual ones or not.

Frist image, here Windows has created an Automatic Restore Point on 23 Dec, 11:02:53 this morning. Second image, my manually created Restore Point added on 23 Dec, 4:26:16 a few minutes ago. You can name your manual Restore Points. This one is "Test"