How to mute something permanently (as in after rebooting)

Lamberto Vitali · Mar 20, 2023

"In any given session"? Why would that mean anything? You might use apps 1 and 2 today and apps 3 and 4 tomorrow, so they all need to be easily accessed.

Mine, from the top of the start menu (top end is most commonly used) are browser, email, game, wordpad, remote utilities (to access other machines), boinctasks (to monitor science programs on this and the other machines), photo editor, calculator, another browser, spreadsheet, .....

I couldn't use different systems for different things, it's easier to have everything in one place. I do have a smartphone I access the internet on, but only out of the house. And I do use Linux, but only for one program, so that's in a virtual machine.

SlicEnDicE · Mar 21, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
It's not faster to click the start button, type word, then press enter. It's quicker to click the start button then click word. I've replaced W O R D ENTER with CLICK. I've dropped 4 interactions.

If you'd take the time to learn, you'd be surprised how much faster it is to interact with the mouse as little as possible. By the time you've moved the mouse to the start menu, not even clicked yet, I've already launched the tool I need. I've learned this way before Windows Start menu became less convenient.

Lamberto Vitali said:
Stop sidestepping. Could be affordability, could be they don't make cars with the function you want anymore, whatever.

You don't buy a diffrent car just to fix it if affordability is a concern. It is far more expensive than buying the one you actually want/need. A car has one function only and that is to take you from location A to location B and back. Unless you're one of those persons who is materialist and need an "extension of your willie"(common Finnish expression) any car that is reliable and is big enough for the need (big family etc...) is great.

If a function in a car has been discontinued....there must be a reason for this...

Lamberto Vitali said:
Closer to your new place of work? Use your imagination.

Fair enough, although I don't move after work, work comes to me. Life choices...

Lamberto Vitali said:
Improving what you have is far better.

Why improve something that you can have from start if choosing smartly in the first place? Plan ahead and don't get stuff just because of an itch. Also in everything there is always something negative and positive to be found. Is the glass half empty or half full?

hdmi · Mar 21, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
Wouldn't you be better with a steering wheel?

No, of course not. It's not a simulator game, it's more like arcade drifting (disguised as an 'FPS' game) so it's all about speed reflexes and accuracy taken beyond the extreme, totally different from all the other Halo games. But it was broken in many ways due to several bugs some of which have never been fixed.

By putting my keyboard on my lap and using the arrow keys on it while using mostly my thumb to keep the keyboard from sliding off to one side, I was able to roll my chair about half a step backward to where I could rest the Scaphoid (see the schematic drawing below) of my hand onto the rounded corner of my desk in front of me (the corner that's right next to the curve of the L-shaped desk similar to the one shown in the pic below, so my screen was standing where that red tulip flower is), so that I could then pivot my hand on this corner and not overload my arm/shoulder─not even in the long run. It sure takes a lot of practice and dedication, and a lot also depends on how exactly you hold your arm, but it's the only way to get real accuracy combined with lightning fast reaction times when pinpointing your crosshair everywhere around your character non stop. Just trust me about it, it works. At least if you don't mind all the calluses on that particular part of your hand. lol

Lamberto Vitali · Mar 21, 2023

SlicEnDicE said:
If you'd take the time to learn, you'd be surprised how much faster it is to interact with the mouse as little as possible. By the time you've moved the mouse to the start menu, not even clicked yet, I've already launched the tool I need. I've learned this way before Windows Start menu became less convenient.

The keyboard is not a magical thing, I can operate the mouse just as quickly. It's not a matter of "learning" anything. It's a matter of how long it would take me. I can time it with a stopwatch. I actually just press the windows key, and a the same time I'm moving the mouse to where I know Word is on the menu. So I'm actually multitasking. It takes far longer to press 6 keys than for each hand to do only 1 thing.

And you're forgetting "word" is ambiguous, will that open Microsoft Word, or Wordpad? Or something else with the word word in it?

SlicEnDicE said:
You don't buy a diffrent car just to fix it if affordability is a concern. It is far more expensive than buying the one you actually want/need.

Not always true. The wone you want might not be made anymore. It might be very expensive.

SlicEnDicE said:
A car has one function only and that is to take you from location A to location B and back.

Right.... no, just no. Some go faster, some are more comfortable, some are larger, some use less fuel, some are more reliable, some have air conditioning, some have a better stereo, some have built in satnav. If you were correct, there would only be one model of car for everyone, probably the Lada Riva.

SlicEnDicE said:
Unless you're one of those persons who is materialist and need an "extension of your willie"(common Finnish expression) any car that is reliable and is big enough for the need (big family etc...) is great.

I bet you wear straw clothes too.

SlicEnDicE said:
If a function in a car has been discontinued....there must be a reason for this...

Lack of popularity, out of stock, didn't pass some stupid legislation, could be anything.

SlicEnDicE said:
Fair enough, although I don't move after work, work comes to me. Life choices...

Depends how much of your type of work is available.

SlicEnDicE said:
Why improve something that you can have from start if choosing smartly in the first place? Plan ahead and don't get stuff just because of an itch.

Getting back to the computers, there is no longer an OS with the functionality of Windows 7. So to get that functionality, you have to use 3rd party software.

SlicEnDicE said:
Also in everything there is always something negative and positive to be found. Is the glass half empty or half full?

But with 3rd party software you can have both.

Lamberto Vitali · Mar 21, 2023

hdmi said:
No, of course not. It's not a simulator game, it's more like arcade drifting (disguised as an 'FPS' game) so it's all about speed reflexes and accuracy taken beyond the extreme, totally different from all the other Halo games. But it was broken in many ways due to several bugs some of which have never been fixed.

By putting my keyboard on my lap and using the arrow keys on it while using mostly my thumb to keep the keyboard from sliding off to one side, I was able to roll my chair about half a step backward to where I could rest the Scaphoid (see the schematic drawing below) of my hand onto the rounded corner of my desk in front of me (the corner that's right next to the curve of the L-shaped desk similar to the one shown in the pic below, so my screen was standing where that red tulip flower is), so that I could then pivot my hand on this corner and not overload my arm/shoulder─not even in the long run. It sure takes a lot of practice and dedication, and a lot also depends on how exactly you hold your arm, but it's the only way to get real accuracy combined with lightning fast reaction times when pinpointing your crosshair everywhere around your character non stop. Just trust me about it, it works. At least if you don't mind all the calluses on that particular part of your hand. lol

So an unrealistic silly game where you're doing maneuvers not possible in a real car with a steering wheel?

Ah, the bone I just broke (or maybe 30 years ago, they're not sure). A little chip off the corner which is rounded as though it happened years ago. I think I just sprained my wrist this time, but the doctor found the chip and was very confused. 30 years ago I broke my arm and they probably never noticed the small injury.

SlicEnDicE · Mar 21, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
I bet you wear straw clothes too.

ofc I do! You don't?

Lamberto Vitali · Mar 21, 2023

SlicEnDicE said:
ofc I do! You don't?

Ah, you're one of the Steve'N'Seagulls band.

hdmi · Mar 21, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
I can spot it instantly in a list of 15. Especially as I know when I'm about to open one how common it is. You surely don't have to look at each one? Some people do and I feel sorry for them (no actually I laugh at them), for example my neighbour was looking for an email from a company, in a list of 500 emails. She was slowly looking through the list, so I took her laptop from her and started pressing page down every second, looking at 30 at a time. She was astonished. I thought anyone could do that. I was just looking for one particular word in the page, I didn't have to read everything to check each word wasn't the one I wanted!

I can instantly spot it too, but doing so causes the kind of added fatigue that is possible to avoid simply by putting it in a place where you don't have to spot it. That is, due to not letting it skip around like a whack-a-mole as the list keeps getting updated all the time. The brain energy and the eye movements are better spent elsewhere, at least IME.

Lamberto Vitali said:
The human brain can do two things at once, so it doesn't take you twice as long to do two clicks. You're also buffering what you're going to do inside the app once it's open.

Sure, but in a number of ways my brain works fundamentally different from the vast majority. For one, the 'helicopter view' thing stretches far beyond the type of multitasking that you describe. The helicopter can see a lot of things at once, but it can still quickly run out of fuel if I let it keep chasing all the wrong targets around the map and all over the map everywhere.

Lamberto Vitali said:
Name some features I may be missing out on.

I already named one, it's the ability to reduce line spacing in the nav pane of File Explorer by using Classic Explorer. Another one is to prevent the expand/collapse arrows from fading in the nav pane. But I'm sure there's many more options, also including in the Classic Start settings of Open-Shell:

Lamberto Vitali said:
Er.... yes of course that happens And it's not so annoying if I had to I mean when I have to close it. I don't restart my computer very often anyway.

My point was that it is possible to avoid and still not have to pay $5 to avoid it. Choosing to just let it nag you to pay for something that already was free even before SAB came out doesn't seem logical to me in any way at all.

Lamberto Vitali said:
Irrelevant. I got a program and it did what I needed.

You needed a program that lets you close a popup on every restart? OK then.. I can make one for you that lets you close TWO popups on every restart. lol

Lamberto Vitali said:
It seems I have one and don't use it, since I never noticed it come back. I remember using the up arrow in very early versions of windows, it's like typing cd.. in DOS. Nowadays I press the back button, the one like in a browser, because it's better. Back may not necessarily be up a level. It's where you were. Lets say I'm in a folder of stuff I've downloaded or transferred from my phone or someone else. I cut or copy some music files, go to my music folder and paste them. The back button takes me back to the files I've received, so I can select some photos and copy them.

On Win XP the Up arrow was a green one above a yellow folder:

Lamberto Vitali said:
Taking a peek means pausing with the mouse and waiting for it to appear, it takes too long. And if you're not sure which icon is which, you'd have to do it on more than one. But the most annoying thing as I've said is they're popping up all the time covering the text I'm trying to read in the current app.

You can change the delay time, and moving the mouse to a neighboring icon doesn't re-trigger the delay. Also, like I already tried to explain (twice), reading through all that text 10 times in a row still takes a whole second in total even if it takes only 100ms on average to read to where you need to point your mouse, whereas waiting for the thumbnail to pop up takes only 400ms by default so, due to the fact that it usually takes much less than 600ms to find the right thumbnail, it's a timesaver still nevertheless (and that's still assuming that you are OK with the default setting of 400ms, which you already admitted is too long). It all mainly boils down to whether you have to do it like maybe 5-10 times less frequently versus how many times you'd have to read text on your taskbar. Like I also said, all the extra reading causes additional fatigue/stress, at least to me, which easily translates to losing even more time still. My workflow already involves a lot of reading to begin with, so the added fatigue is worsened also as a result of that fact. They don't pop up if you don't hover your mouse over the icons, which just never happens to me by accident.

Lamberto Vitali said:
Again, it doesn't take me more than a fraction of second to spot a word in a single line of text. and usually I subconsciously remember where on the taskbar it is. Something recently opened will be further to the right.

Same here, in pretty much every way excepting only the extra reading fatigue.

Lamberto Vitali said:
I think we agree - everything should be absolutely customisable in every way. You have to wonder why they remove customisation. Does it make it easier to code? Does it make the system run faster? Does it make it easier to explain to someone else how to do something because their screen will look the same? No that doesn't work, since when you look up how to do something, chances are you find instructions written before the last update.

That's how Microsoft behaves. It's among main reasons why I never became a Microsoft .NET developer, and why 17 years ago I turned to the Enterprise Java career path instead.

Lamberto Vitali said:
I don't do breaks unless I need food (which I just eat at the desk anyway), need to go to the toilet, or am called away to speak to someone. So fatigue doesn't come into it. It's just some nuts invented by unions so people can work less for the same pay.

It definitely isn't like that in my line of work.

Lamberto Vitali said:
How can you find the layout distracting anyway? It shows you an image of exactly what the app looks like. Just like the popups from the taskbar you like.

It's the image size, the number of images and the borders.

Lamberto Vitali said:
That would never come up for me. The only apps I have several things open in are tabbed.

Outside of Firefox there's only few apps I use that are tabbed, I disabled tabs in File Explorer and in the Notepad app, and, I use the classic command window and classic PowerShell window instead of the tabbed Windows Terminal app.

Lamberto Vitali said:
Apart from tablets and phones and kiosks, nobody uses a touchscreen on their desktop! This is a desktop OS!

That's how Microsoft behaves.

Lamberto Vitali said:
I do find I click the wrong thing less often, but I'm having to scroll more often to find it. However I can now click inbetween the lines to paste a file into the folder. Before you had to scroll to the end or hope there was a blank space on the right!

Classic Explorer of Open-Shell lets you add a toolbar with customizable commands and customizable submenus.

Lamberto Vitali said:
Ah! Thankyou! Now I don't need to buy a bigger monitor just to view a list of files. WTF were they thinking making the default that way round?

That's how Microsoft behaves.

Lamberto Vitali said:
It seems people spend half their day hunting down how to put things back the way they were!

It's so people don't spend half their day talking to each other about going on strike. lol

Lamberto Vitali said:
Argh you've lost me. Look, there are two different settings going on here, and I can't see the distinction in the instructions you've given. Is the mic being recorded (I want that on all the time), and is the mic playing through to the speaker (I usually want that off, but want to be able to easily turn it on briefly.

Well if you want it to be on ALL the time, then of course the NirSoft utility won't help. But, compared to how long it takes before the NirSoft command is able to finish after you reboot, it may take a few additional moments before the Sound window can finally appear. So, I was just assuming that you might want to let the mic be muted, just for a short period, i.e., just until the "Listen to this device" checkbox gets unchecked which stops the sound going through your speakers. If my assumption is correct, then you could use the NirSoft utility from within a task in Task Scheduler so as to mute the mic right after you log on to Windows. A few moments ater that, the checkbox gets automatically unchecked, via rundll32.exe shell32.dll,Control_RunDLL mmsys.cpl,,1 (or just control mmsys.cpl,,1 ) followed by the simulated keystrokes (Down arrow a few times to select the mic, Spacebar to bring up the Properties panel, Shift + Tab a few times to move the focus to the checkbox, Spacebar to toggle the checkbox, Enter to apply the changes closing the Properties window panel, Esc or Enter again to close the Sound window). Finally, the mic gets unmuted again via the NirSoft utility.

The only difference here would be that the sound stops coming from your speakers a few moments earlier than the moment when the checkbox gets unchecked, and as a sacrifice the mic does get muted of course, but it will be muted only during these same few moments.

hdmi · Mar 21, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
Sausages? How do you equate anything on the taskbar to a sausage?

Just look at the blue one under the Chrome icon in this post and then tell me that doesn't look like a sausage?

EDIT: I also can see grey pills and a red pill, but no blue pill. No wonder that they couldn't get their taskbar to stand up vertical.

hdmi · Mar 21, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
So an unrealistic silly game where you're doing maneuvers not possible in a real car with a steering wheel?

Yeah, it was the only online multiplayer fast action FPS game able to replace Quake III Team Arena for me.

Lamberto Vitali · Mar 23, 2023

hdmi said:
Same here, with the exception of most recent apps because I have disabled that one in Open-Shell settings so only most recently opened items are listed in Start menu (in a separate submenu as well as in jumplists). There's no need for SAB in that regard, as Open-Shell still works the same as ClassicShell, and these features were added to it way more than a decade ago (I started using ClassicShell at the end of 2009 when ClassicShell was still an early beta and people got their underpants up in a twist because Microsoft had replaced the up arrow button with breadcrumbs.)

I just tried openshell. It omits a very important function for me. The ability to have text on taskbar buttons for running apps. Back to startallback.

hdmi · Mar 23, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
I just tried openshell. It omits a very important function for me. The ability to have text on taskbar buttons for running apps. Back to startallback.

It doesn't "omit" it. Rather, it merely acknowledges the fact that there never was a need to reinvent the wheel.

7+ Taskbar Tweaker - Ramen Software

Of course on Win 11 to get 7+ TT to work you'd first have to bring the Win 10 taskbar back, but then, that mainly is why I (and many others like me) have been using ExplorerPatcher.

GitHub - valinet/ExplorerPatcher: This project aims to enhance the working environment on Windows

This project aims to enhance the working environment on Windows - valinet/ExplorerPatcher

github.com

That said, some (or a lot of) people prefer "to keep it simple" (the "KISS" principle─Keep It Simple Stupid). But personally, I, prefer to follow Albert Einstein's advice, which was to keep everything as simple as possible. Not simpler. If I wanted something so overly simple that it being simple is what factually makes it stupid, then I'd buy a Mac.

Lamberto Vitali · Mar 23, 2023

hdmi said:
It doesn't "omit" it. Rather, it merely acknowledges the fact that there never was a need to reinvent the wheel.

7+ Taskbar Tweaker - Ramen Software
Of course on Win 11 to get 7+ TT to work you'd first have to bring the Win 10 taskbar back, but then, that mainly is why I (and many others like me) have been using ExplorerPatcher.

GitHub - valinet/ExplorerPatcher: This project aims to enhance the working environment on Windows

This project aims to enhance the working environment on Windows - valinet/ExplorerPatcher

github.com

Why install more than one program? Startallback does everything.

hdmi said:
That said, some (or a lot of) people prefer "to keep it simple" (the "KISS" principle─Keep It Simple Stupid). But personally, I, prefer to follow Albert Einstein's advice, which was to keep everything as simple as possible. Not simpler. If I wanted something so overly simple that it being simple is what factually makes it stupid, then I'd buy a Mac.

I agree on the Macs, but MS is making Windows like Macs. The world has ended.

hdmi · Mar 24, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
Why install more than one program? Startallback does everything.

I agree on the Macs, but MS is making Windows like Macs. The world has ended.

It's because SAB does not do everything of course, and like I said it does (very) little more than the things that already were possible to begin with, WITHOUT receiving a popup window adding a big pair of sad faced emoji's to your Start menu when you DON'T want to send your money. It almost borders right there on the edge of being a blatant ripoff, and, it doesn't actually even matter to me that it's only $5. Sorry, but it is what it is. Even if you use Open-Shell alongside ExplorerPatcher, Battery Mode, TranslucentTB app and 7+ TT (or Windhawk on Win 11), then there's still a lot more stuff that you can add. E.g., I also use a small number of registry tweaks (most of which also come included in Winearo Tweaker or Ultimate Windows Tweaker, but certainly not all of them do) in addition to my own scripts/programs that I have written myself. I don't obsess over the number of programs, as long as they let me do what I want to do, and as long as they aren't causing any compatibility issues with each other or anything like that. And they don't bog the system down. Below is a screenshot of how my Start menu and taskbar looks like on Win 11 (the selection of icons that are visible in this screenshot were chosen mainly at random─only for example purposes).

Lamberto Vitali · Apr 17, 2023

Startallback = a nag screen once a day or a few dollars.
Otherwise, multiple programs, much inconvenience.
Considering the extortionate amount of money we're (supposed) to pay for Windows....

Ghot · Apr 17, 2023

Here's another one...

Power Start Menu - Official app in the Microsoft Store

Tweak the start menu of windows 11 to unleash the full POWER. This app currently enables you to customize the looks of the Start menu in Windows 11, including background transparency, hide search box, hide suggestions. You may customize how power button works, and how all apps panel is...

apps.microsoft.com

Lamberto Vitali · Apr 18, 2023

Store. Ugh.

hdmi · Apr 19, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
Startallback = a nag screen once a day or a few dollars.
Otherwise, multiple programs, much inconvenience.
Considering the extortionate amount of money we're (supposed) to pay for Windows....

You got that bass ackwards. Multiple programs = more options to eliminate the inconveniences from Windows so, less inconvenience and no nag screens, and also no need to pay anything. lol

Lamberto Vitali · Apr 19, 2023

hdmi said:
You got that bass ackwards. Multiple programs = more options to eliminate the inconveniences from Windows so, less inconvenience and no nag screens, and also no need to pay anything. lol

There are all the options I need in startallback, and I can see them all in one place.

I have no intention of paying, the nag screen only appears once a day when I unlock the screen. And I only do that incase a parrot attacks the keyboard at night. I hardly notice the frowning face.

And I can always get it free if I really tried.

hdmi · Apr 20, 2023

Lamberto Vitali said:
There are all the options I need in startallback, and I can see them all in one place.

Whether you NEED additional options is entirely for you to decide. But there ARE additional options when you combine multiple programs like I have explained, and they are MUCH more numerous than many would like to assume.