Solved Macrium Reflect Free - Odd image size?


wiganken

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Macrium Reflect Free v8.0.7783

I create new Differential images weekly and, for the first time today I saw that the created Diff image is smaller than the previous Diff image of 1-week ago? I have been using my computer every day and I understood that Differential images always increased in size as time went on due to more changes happening relative to the original 'Full' backup. There have been app updates as well as new user files created.

To be sure it was not a one-off anomaly I created a second Diff image and it was the same? I checked the MR logs in case I had made a mistake but I hadn't. See photo of my image records.
I did not think this was possible since there have been more changes in the 7-day period in-between compared with the Full image.

Has anyone else had this happen? Can anyone explain how this might have happened?

Smaller Diff image.png
 
Last edited:

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    Windows 11 Pro
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The differential is a reflectiion of data that has changed since the last FULL backup. If you continue to add new data, then each differential will grow in size. However, if you delete data that was present in previous differential backups, there may be less to backup now, thus, a smaller differential.
 

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    Win11 Pro 23H2
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Also, newer DATA may have been much more compressible.
 

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Also, newer DATA may have been much more compressible.
But bear in mind that newer data won't make previous data any more compressible, so it would still be growing in size. The only way a differential would ever shrink in size is if there was actually less data to backup as a result of blocks being removed.
 

My Computers

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  • OS
    Win11 Pro 23H2
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    PC/Desktop
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    Home Built
    CPU
    Intel i7-11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A
    Memory
    128GB Crucial Ballistix 3200MHz DRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - CPU graphics only (for now)
    Sound Card
    Realtek (on motherboard)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe Gen 4 x 4 SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe Gen 3 x 4 SSD
    2 x 512GB 2.5" SSDs
    2 x 8TB HD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCue 5000X RGB
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black cooler + 10 case fans
    Keyboard
    CODE backlit mechanical keyboard
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    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
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    Additional options installed:
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    ASUS ThunderboltEX 4 PCIe adapter
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
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    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
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    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
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    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
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    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
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    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
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    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
I just created a new Restore Point which made it the 8th one.
In between clicking the create and successful , the two last ones were
deleted. The folder was 17 GB and now it's 12.5 GB. Could this account
for the difference?
 

My Computers

System One System Two

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    windows 11 22631.3447
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    MSI Raider GE76
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    Core i9 12th gen 12900HK 2.9 MHz
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    MSI
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    32 Gigs DDR5-4800
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    nVidia RTX 3070 Ti / 8 Gigs DDR6
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    DYNAUDIO - Klipsch 2.1 THX - Sound Effects by Nahimic 3
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17.3" 1920 x 1080 360 Hz 3 ms, IPS / Connected to MSI 32 inch curved @ 165 Hz
    Screen Resolution
    1920 x 1080 / Both
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    Samsung 990 Pro 2TB (OS) - Solidigm P41 2TB (Storage)
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    280 watts
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    MSI GE series
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    1000 Mbps
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    Firefox / Opera GX- Do not like Edge
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    Malwarebytes'
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    just ask.
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    Windows 10 22H2
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    MSI GT73 7RE VR Titan
    CPU
    Intel Core i7 7820HK 2.9 Ghz
    Motherboard
    MSI
    Memory
    16 Gigs DDR4 2400 Mhz
    Graphics card(s)
    nVidia 1070 8GB RAM
    Sound Card
    DYNAUDIO / Nahimic 2
    Monitor(s) Displays
    IPS / 120HZ
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080P
    Hard Drives
    Samsung NVME EVO 970 1TB / Samsung SSD (SATA) 1TB
    PSU
    240 watts
    Case
    MSI
    Cooling
    Internal
    Mouse
    Logitech G903 Lightspeed
    Keyboard
    Steelseries
    Internet Speed
    1 Gb/s
    Browser
    Firefox / Vivaldi
    Antivirus
    MalwareBytes'
    Other Info
    none.
I just created a new Restore Point which made it the 8th one.
In between clicking the create and successful , the two last ones were
deleted. The folder was 17 GB and now it's 12.5 GB. Could this account
for the difference?
Sure. While you provide no details on what type of backups you have and your retention policies, it is certainly possible.
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Home Built
    CPU
    Intel i7-11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A
    Memory
    128GB Crucial Ballistix 3200MHz DRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - CPU graphics only (for now)
    Sound Card
    Realtek (on motherboard)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe Gen 4 x 4 SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe Gen 3 x 4 SSD
    2 x 512GB 2.5" SSDs
    2 x 8TB HD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCue 5000X RGB
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black cooler + 10 case fans
    Keyboard
    CODE backlit mechanical keyboard
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    Additional options installed:
    WiFi 6E PCIe adapter
    ASUS ThunderboltEX 4 PCIe adapter
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
    Hard Drives
    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
    PSU
    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
    Mouse
    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
    Keyboard
    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
Sure. While you provide no details on what type of backups you have and your retention policies, it is certainly possible.
Not for me but for @wiganken . Could this account for his discrepancies?
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    windows 11 22631.3447
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI Raider GE76
    CPU
    Core i9 12th gen 12900HK 2.9 MHz
    Motherboard
    MSI
    Memory
    32 Gigs DDR5-4800
    Graphics Card(s)
    nVidia RTX 3070 Ti / 8 Gigs DDR6
    Sound Card
    DYNAUDIO - Klipsch 2.1 THX - Sound Effects by Nahimic 3
    Monitor(s) Displays
    17.3" 1920 x 1080 360 Hz 3 ms, IPS / Connected to MSI 32 inch curved @ 165 Hz
    Screen Resolution
    1920 x 1080 / Both
    Hard Drives
    Samsung 990 Pro 2TB (OS) - Solidigm P41 2TB (Storage)
    PSU
    280 watts
    Case
    MSI GE series
    Cooling
    internal
    Keyboard
    Steelseries
    Mouse
    G903 Lightspeed
    Internet Speed
    1000 Mbps
    Browser
    Firefox / Opera GX- Do not like Edge
    Antivirus
    Malwarebytes'
    Other Info
    just ask.
  • Operating System
    Windows 10 22H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    MSI GT73 7RE VR Titan
    CPU
    Intel Core i7 7820HK 2.9 Ghz
    Motherboard
    MSI
    Memory
    16 Gigs DDR4 2400 Mhz
    Graphics card(s)
    nVidia 1070 8GB RAM
    Sound Card
    DYNAUDIO / Nahimic 2
    Monitor(s) Displays
    IPS / 120HZ
    Screen Resolution
    1920x1080P
    Hard Drives
    Samsung NVME EVO 970 1TB / Samsung SSD (SATA) 1TB
    PSU
    240 watts
    Case
    MSI
    Cooling
    Internal
    Mouse
    Logitech G903 Lightspeed
    Keyboard
    Steelseries
    Internet Speed
    1 Gb/s
    Browser
    Firefox / Vivaldi
    Antivirus
    MalwareBytes'
    Other Info
    none.
Not for me but for @wiganken . Could this account for his discrepancies?
Once again, the only way a newer differential will be smaller is if blocks that were previously occupied have been deleted. Let's use an example to make this clear...

You create a full image backup of your drive.

You now add a bunch of files to the drive totaling 20 GB. If you now take a differential backup, you would be backing up 20GB of data. The actual backup may be smaller due to compression.

Now you delete 10GB of that 20GB of data that you added previously. You take a differential backup. SINCE THE FULL BACKUP you now only have 10GB of changed data (the 20GB you added minus the 10GB you deleted). This means that the differential backup only needs to backup 10GB of data rather than the 20GB it had to backup the last time.

Note that this is true only of data added to the drive AFTER the full backup was taken because the differential is only concerned with changes made AFTER that full backup was created.

Does this help?
 

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Home Built
    CPU
    Intel i7-11700K
    Motherboard
    ASUS Prime Z590-A
    Memory
    128GB Crucial Ballistix 3200MHz DRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    No GPU - CPU graphics only (for now)
    Sound Card
    Realtek (on motherboard)
    Monitor(s) Displays
    HP Envy 32
    Screen Resolution
    2560 x 1440
    Hard Drives
    1 x 1TB NVMe Gen 4 x 4 SSD
    1 x 2TB NVMe Gen 3 x 4 SSD
    2 x 512GB 2.5" SSDs
    2 x 8TB HD
    PSU
    Corsair HX850i
    Case
    Corsair iCue 5000X RGB
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-D15 chromax.black cooler + 10 case fans
    Keyboard
    CODE backlit mechanical keyboard
    Mouse
    Logitech MX Master 3
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1 Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    Additional options installed:
    WiFi 6E PCIe adapter
    ASUS ThunderboltEX 4 PCIe adapter
  • Operating System
    Win11 Pro 23H2
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    Lenovo ThinkBook 13x Gen 2
    CPU
    Intel i7-1255U
    Memory
    16 GB
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel Iris Xe Graphics
    Sound Card
    Realtek® ALC3306-CG codec
    Monitor(s) Displays
    13.3-inch IPS Display
    Screen Resolution
    WQXGA (2560 x 1600)
    Hard Drives
    2 TB 4 x 4 NVMe SSD
    PSU
    USB-C / Thunderbolt 4 Power / Charging
    Mouse
    Buttonless Glass Precision Touchpad
    Keyboard
    Backlit, spill resistant keyboard
    Internet Speed
    1Gb Up / 1Gb Down
    Browser
    Edge
    Antivirus
    Windows Defender
    Other Info
    WiFi 6e / Bluetooth 5.1 / Facial Recognition / Fingerprint Sensor / ToF (Time of Flight) Human Presence Sensor
@hsehestedt - Yes that helps me to understand how it may have happened. The only thing is that I can't remember deleting anything in the last 7-days (since previous image) to explain it. What is even more odd is that the amount of data I would have had to delete to offset the 'usual' increase would have to be around 2 to 3 GB and I certainly can't remember deleting that amount of data. I thought I would remember deleting that large an amount. I may have defragmented the SSD but I don't see that as accounting for 2 to 3GB of data.

@Flashorn - I have system restore disabled (since I use Macrium Reflect) and have no Restore Points. See photo.

I'll just have to accept that I must have deleted a block of data that was present in previous image but can't remember doing so. I'm getting old :-) but what made me ask the question is that this is the first time this has happened in the 5-years I have been using MR. In the past Diff images have always increased in size.

No RPs.png
 
Last edited:

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    HP EliteDesk 705 G5
    CPU
    AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 3400GE
    Memory
    8GB DDR4 SDRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Integrated AMD Radeon Vega 11
    Hard Drives
    256 GB PCIe NVMe M.2 SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    DELL Inspiron 15-3576
    CPU
    Intel Core i5-8250U
    Memory
    8 GB DDR4 - 2400 SODIMM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics 620
    Hard Drives
    256GB SK Hynix SC311 SATA SSD
I have looked into this some more and it seems that differential images should always be larger than the previous image so it seems like a glitch to me. I hope the next differential image is larger or else I will be wondering if MR has become unreliable.
In fact, I think I will start again with a new 'Full' image since I am not sure I can trust this last 'Diff' image.
See @Bree post: -
 
Last edited:

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    HP EliteDesk 705 G5
    CPU
    AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 3400GE
    Memory
    8GB DDR4 SDRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Integrated AMD Radeon Vega 11
    Hard Drives
    256 GB PCIe NVMe M.2 SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    DELL Inspiron 15-3576
    CPU
    Intel Core i5-8250U
    Memory
    8 GB DDR4 - 2400 SODIMM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics 620
    Hard Drives
    256GB SK Hynix SC311 SATA SSD
See my differential backups below, mine aren't always bigger....


1709832204336.png
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Win 11
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    N/A
    CPU
    AMD Ryzen 5 5600x
    Motherboard
    ASUS Crosshair Viii Hero Wi Fi
    Memory
    32 Gb DDR4 3600MHz GSkill
    Graphics Card(s)
    NVidia Geforce 950
    Sound Card
    USB Out NAD M51 DAC with Adams A8 speakers
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Dell 3219Q
    Screen Resolution
    3840 x 2160
    Hard Drives
    2 x Samsung EVO 970 1 Gb SSD
    PSU
    Seasonic 1200W
    Case
    CoolerMaster ATCS 840
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-U12S Chromax
    Keyboard
    Roccat FX
    Mouse
    Steel Series Rival 650 Wirelss
    Internet Speed
    Starlink 94Mbps down 20Mbps up
    Browser
    Brave
    Antivirus
    ESET

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    HP EliteDesk 705 G5
    CPU
    AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 3400GE
    Memory
    8GB DDR4 SDRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Integrated AMD Radeon Vega 11
    Hard Drives
    256 GB PCIe NVMe M.2 SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    DELL Inspiron 15-3576
    CPU
    Intel Core i5-8250U
    Memory
    8 GB DDR4 - 2400 SODIMM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics 620
    Hard Drives
    256GB SK Hynix SC311 SATA SSD
@OldNavy - Regarding your photo showing image list: - Is that from your MR log file or are you actually storing that many 'Diff' images? If you are storing them I suggest you create a new 'Full' image and delete all previous images. You will regain 65 GB of disk space.

To keep things simple I set retention rules to store 1-'Full' image and only 2-'Diff' images
 
Last edited:

My Computers

System One System Two

  • OS
    Windows 11 Pro
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    HP EliteDesk 705 G5
    CPU
    AMD Ryzen 5 Pro 3400GE
    Memory
    8GB DDR4 SDRAM
    Graphics Card(s)
    Integrated AMD Radeon Vega 11
    Hard Drives
    256 GB PCIe NVMe M.2 SSD
  • Operating System
    Windows 11 Home
    Computer type
    Laptop
    Manufacturer/Model
    DELL Inspiron 15-3576
    CPU
    Intel Core i5-8250U
    Memory
    8 GB DDR4 - 2400 SODIMM
    Graphics card(s)
    Intel UHD Graphics 620
    Hard Drives
    256GB SK Hynix SC311 SATA SSD
wiganken,
I'm not sure it is an issue. It could be something as simple as clearing my browser cache which could be 1 or 2 GB's.
My backup regime is to make a full image every second Sunday and differentials in between. I keep 3 sets as an archive as disk space is not a problem.
I've never had a restore failure.
 

My Computer

System One

  • OS
    Win 11
    Computer type
    PC/Desktop
    Manufacturer/Model
    N/A
    CPU
    AMD Ryzen 5 5600x
    Motherboard
    ASUS Crosshair Viii Hero Wi Fi
    Memory
    32 Gb DDR4 3600MHz GSkill
    Graphics Card(s)
    NVidia Geforce 950
    Sound Card
    USB Out NAD M51 DAC with Adams A8 speakers
    Monitor(s) Displays
    Dell 3219Q
    Screen Resolution
    3840 x 2160
    Hard Drives
    2 x Samsung EVO 970 1 Gb SSD
    PSU
    Seasonic 1200W
    Case
    CoolerMaster ATCS 840
    Cooling
    Noctua NH-U12S Chromax
    Keyboard
    Roccat FX
    Mouse
    Steel Series Rival 650 Wirelss
    Internet Speed
    Starlink 94Mbps down 20Mbps up
    Browser
    Brave
    Antivirus
    ESET

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