time to replace components in wife's computer for dreaded Win10 to Win11

kelper said:

@Scannerman

You said, "I don't think I own a PC with less than 16GB of system RAM"

Perhaps your internal RAM need an upgrade! Or a refresh!

Click to expand...

lol At my age I could probably use a complete refresh. I'm pretty sure I don't have a PC with less than 16 GB of system RAM. Maybe I have an old laptop somewhere in the cobwebs with less. I really need to offload some of these PCs. But.. but.. they have value!

Scannerman said:

lol At my age I could probably use a complete refresh. I'm pretty sure I don't have a PC with less than 16 GB of system RAM. Maybe I have an old laptop somewhere in the cobwebs with less. I really need to offload some of these PCs. But.. but.. they have value!

Click to expand...

I have some old laptops I don't want to part with. One is still able to run the software for my Sony Aibo robot dog. Later Windows OS's refuse to do so.

I recently purged a bunch of old laptops, five of them I believe. There comes time when cleanout is mandatory!

True. People don't bring me computers like they used to anymore so I'm winding down. I also avoid garage sales and recycling bins. lol About every three years or so I do a purging. Most of it comprises old proprietary stuff and a great deal of it is in fact laptops. I no longer have the eyes to repair laptops for people and I don't have a scope. Don't want one. I'm busy enough with desk top PCs.

Here in Greece an entry level new computer or laptop is 300€+ so you don't want to replace it every 2-3 years. Ideally you want to replace it after 10+ years. "If it works, don't fix it", as they say. Today's refurbished computers and laptops cost 150€-200€ and many of them are Windows 11 compliant. So if I ever replace my current system it will be with a newer generation refurbished, not with a current generation brand new one. I don't need the extra performance, I am not gaming, so why pay for it?

spapakons said:

Here in Greece an entry level new computer or laptop is 300€+ so you don't want to replace it every 2-3 years. Ideally you want to replace it after 10+ years. "If it works, don't fix it", as they say. Today's refurbished computers and laptops cost 150€-200€ and many of them are Windows 11 compliant. So if I ever replace my current system it will be with a newer generation refurbished, not with a current generation brand new one. I don't need the extra performance, I am not gaming, so why pay for it?

Click to expand...

WOW, $350 or so won't buy much of a computer in the USA! I have well over $1,000 into this system, and the new Monitor was $550!

gunrunnerjohn said:

WOW, $350 or so won't buy much of a computer in the USA! I have well over $1,000 into this system, and the new Monitor was $550!

Click to expand...

I wont even mention what the total cost of my latest build was; just that the motherboard alone was near 1K. As a photographer, I paid a mint for my monitor - Ezio ColorEdge CG2700X, but I was also printing and selling my work so it was also an investment

At any rate, while you don't need to spend anywhere near what I spent on my build, yeah, $350 USD isn't getting you anything, but low cheap, even if only a laptop. I went to look at a new Samsung Galaxy tablet for my wife and to get equal to what she has now is $479 USD. When I got the one she has now it was $299 back in 2018

Anyway, my PC is not just for gaming, but multimedia in general - photography, video, music, business. And I multitask a lot.

spapakons said:

Today's refurbished computers and laptops cost 150€-200€ and many of them are Windows 11 compliant. So if I ever replace my current system it will be with a newer generation refurbished, not with a current generation brand new one

Click to expand...

gunrunnerjohn said:

WOW, $350 or so won't buy much of a computer in the USA! I have well over $1,000 into this system, and the new Monitor was $550!

Click to expand...

Dru2 said:

$350 USD isn't getting you anything, but low cheap, even if only a laptop

Click to expand...

I don't think I've ever bought new. I get all my laptops from Cash Converters, a pawn shop chain with an on-line store here in the UK. They have an eclectic mix of models, ranging from rubbish up to a few new/unused. Sifting through, there are occasional gems amongst the dross.

I'm posting this from my 2nd most recent purchase, a W11 compatible Dell Latitude 3190 2-in-1, Pentium Silver N5030, 8GB RAM, 512GB NVMe, came with W10 Pro (and promptly got a clean install of W11 Pro). I paid £80 for it.

My most recent purchase was 8 months old when I bought it. At £880 it was the most I've ever paid for a laptop (by a long way). I had to think long and hard before clicking 'buy'. It's a Dell Latitude 5550, Core Ultra 7 165H, 64GB RAM, 1TB NVMe with W11 Pro. As an added bonus it came with Dell ProSupport until June 2027.

spapakons said:

Today's refurbished computers and laptops cost 150€-200€ and many of them are Windows 11 compliant.

Click to expand...

The Windows 11 compliant part may not hold true if the rumors about new MS requirements are correct.

Dru2 said:

Anyway, my PC is not just for gaming, but multimedia in general - photography, video, music, business. And I multitask a lot.

Click to expand...

My development work doesn't require massive computing power, mine is more than sufficient. The GPU was for my 3D modeling, other than that I'd have stuck with the motherboard video. I spent a lot of the money on 16TB of SSD drives.

Bree said:

I don't think I've ever bought new. I get all my laptops from Cash Converters, a pawn shop chain with an on-line store here in the UK. They have an eclectic mix of models, ranging from rubbish up to a few new/unused. Sifting through, there are occasional gems amongst the dross.

Click to expand...

I don't know of any place I could get a decent machine used or that might be an option.

gunrunnerjohn said:

WOW, $350 or so won't buy much of a computer in the USA! I have well over $1,000 into this system, and the new Monitor was $550!

Click to expand...

I was talking about ENTRY level office computer. For gaming you need over 500€ and for good performance gaming you need close to 1000€. Imagine a parent having invested 1000€ and then have to replace it because Microsoft decided it is obsolete. As long as there is a workaround I would keep bypassing compatibility check and upgrade it until it is that old it can only be used for office work. As for keeping good performance, I would upgrade only the GPU as long as it is possible. Why replace the whole system? I don't "give birth to money", as we say in Greek. I have to earn it. Most people's wage is lower than 1000€. So we usually buy a computer with monthly installments. A few months after we have finally paid the final installment it is "obsolete" and we have to replace it? Give me a break! Would you replace it or any other expensive device, such as your smart TV every 2-3 years? I don't think so.

On a good day the Canadian dollar runs around 70 cents US. There's no way you'll get your hands on a laptop that you can get any real gaming done for 500 CA so it's much the same here as it is in Greece. I know this because my girls are massive gamers and they've jammed up a few laptops with their appetites for gaming. It is much the same with desk tops here also. Two of the units here are running Haswell CPUs and they seem to be doing alright. (I'm referring to gaming of course.) Two other units are ancient X58 platforms and I've managed to keep the other two daughters happy with those just by upgrading the GFX cards and the drives on those but they are at the bottleneck stage where the CPU can't deliver what the GPU wants to provide.

Fortunately one of them will be heading off to university this year and won't have need of a gaming PC. The other one is following closely in her sister's footsteps and likes to play the vintage games. The youngest is enjoying the Haswell with the 4790K in it so it may be a couple of years before she's ready to move up. I'm thinking of letting her have the Crossfire X570 since I don't normally use it a whole lot. The gen 4 platform with Win 11 should be enough for her until she's ready for college. She's also the only one in the house (apart from me) who actually uses Windows 11.

Upgrading is definitely worth doing until it isn't. Once again it really depends on the needs of the user and, of course, user preference prevails.

gunrunnerjohn said:

My development work doesn't require massive computing power, mine is more than sufficient. The GPU was for my 3D modeling, other than that I'd have stuck with the motherboard video. I spent a lot of the money on 16TB of SSD drives.

Click to expand...

Sorry for giving you the impression I was competing. I'm wasn't. I was simply replying to your comment here.....

gunrunnerjohn said:

WOW, $350 or so won't buy much of a computer in the USA! I have well over $1,000 into this system, and the new Monitor was $550!

Click to expand...

Bree said:

I don't think I've ever bought new. I get all my laptops from Cash Converters, a pawn shop chain with an on-line store here in the UK. They have an eclectic mix of models, ranging from rubbish up to a few new/unused. Sifting through, there are occasional gems amongst the dross.

Click to expand...

I don't buy used PCs or PC parts. Never did. I had a friend like you who shopped for used laptops, but it just wasn't my cup of tea.

Dru2 said:

Sorry for giving you the impression I was competing. I'm wasn't. I was simply replying to your comment here.....



I don't buy used PCs or PC parts. Never did. I had a friend like you who shopped for used laptops, but it just wasn't my cup of tea.

Click to expand...

I would not buy a used part if I could find a refurbished alternative or a new one at reasonable price. I could not find a refurbished socket 1155 Core-i5 or i7 CPU to upgrade my then 3rd generation Core-i3 and of course I wouldn't like to replace the whole PC. So I had a look at respectful trading (auction?) sites such as www.isomnia.gr that users can sell their old parts. eBay or Amazon is outside Greece and the shipping costs would raise the price considerably. I found a used 3rd generation Intel Core-i7 3770 3.5GHz CPU (3.9GHz Turbo Boost), so I risked it and bought it for a reasonable price of just 80€ (new was close to 300€). Thankfully it works and this is the CPU of my main PC (2nd system specs). The only disadvantage was that the previous owner wanted to keep the CPU cooler and I used my old Core-i3 one which was not adequate. Eventually I had overheating issues and I replaced it, but it did its job for at least a year. Still much cheaper than spending 300€+ to replace CPU+motherboard+RAM for a "proper" upgrade to a newer generation. Refurbished computers and parts have at least 1 year Warranty from the store, so the risk is much lower. So I don't recommend to buy used stuff unless there is no alternative and you know what you are doing and understand the risks. But I do recommend to buy refurbished stuff in place of new, as long as the specs meet your needs. They are usually half the price or less of an equivalent new part (such as ref older generation Core-i3 CPU vs 12th gen or newer Core-i3).

spapakons said:

I would not buy a used part if I could find a refurbished alternative or a new one at reasonable price. ......

Click to expand...

I should state (for me) that I also don't buy refurbished where PC / PC parts are concerned. It's just a comfort level I get when buying new that I wouldn't have when buying used or refurbished. I know for some it's a great way to save money, or get a great deal on a part or PC, but for me it's also about being comfortable with the item I'm buying - I just don't want questions should something go wrong or start acting up. Again, that's me.

If you're one that's comfortable with refurbished, that's great. Not dishing anyone there; I'm simply stating it's not for me.

If anything goes wrong with the hardware, there is 1 year Warranty. If I am that unlucky to have the issue after Warranty, I can take that risk. If anything goes wrong with software, I am an expert and know how to fix it. Besides, I wouldn't keep the preinstalled (reinstalled) Windows, I would format and clean install Windows 11 or move my old SSD to the ref and try to boot it.

spapakons said:

I was talking about ENTRY level office computer. For gaming you need over 500€ and for good performance gaming you need close to 1000€. Imagine a parent having invested 1000€ and then have to replace it because Microsoft decided it is obsolete. As long as there is a workaround I would keep bypassing compatibility check and upgrade it until it is that old it can only be used for office work. As for keeping good performance, I would upgrade only the GPU as long as it is possible. Why replace the whole system? I don't "give birth to money", as we say in Greek. I have to earn it. Most people's wage is lower than 1000€. So we usually buy a computer with monthly installments. A few months after we have finally paid the final installment it is "obsolete" and we have to replace it? Give me a break! Would you replace it or any other expensive device, such as your smart TV every 2-3 years? I don't think so.

Click to expand...

Maybe you should switch to decaf, you're getting pretty excited here! I don't "give birth to money" either, I earned every dollar I have. I replace things when they need replacement. My last computer system was new in 2016, so I got nine years out of it. I know we're regaled all the time here about how many folks can cut corners and do things on a shoestring, I don't typically work that way. When I upgraded, I didn't want to try to find work-arounds to every quirk of Windows so I could run it on ancient hardware. I spent my life designing mission critical avionics hardware, and that mindset has carried over into my personal life, I use equipment that's designed for the job.

I will say I'm impressed that anyone can life on 1000€/mo, obviously the cost of living where you live is nothing like it is here! 1000€ wouldn't even cover our basic utility bills most months, and we'd be really hungry since there's be nothing left over for food! The property taxes alone would eat up most of that 1000€.

Scannerman said:

There's a difference?

Click to expand...

Yes. With a cloned drive one can just swap the drives. With a image one has to do a restore. Because I have had problems with cloned drives I now only do system images.

Winuser said:

Yes. With a cloned drive one can just swap the drives. With a image one has to do a restore. Because I have had problems with cloned drives I now only do system images.

Click to expand...

Yes. I realized my misunderstanding later. Perhaps it is due to my old school experience. For me, a drive image means a precise, bit-by-bit copy of the entire drive. More specifically, a System Image is a copy of the OS and it requires a restoration to get back the apps, programs, and personal files. I don't know that I've had issues with cloned drives before when they are done correctly. R Drive Image seemed to do a pretty good job when I used it right but I haven't used it since the 8.1 days. To the best of my knowledge all my drive images (aka "clones") have turned out okay since I started using Mini Tool Pro Ultimate. Admittedly it takes a while to make a clone but SSDs have really speeded up the process.