Update on Windows 11 minimum system requirements

i486 · Jul 1, 2021

jen1 said:
The 7th and 8th gen have 145 known errata with possible solutions if exist, while the the 6th gen has 198 known errata.

I hope this will clarify things for you.

p.s don't trust sources online, just go back to the origin

Well alright then. Not that that makes the 7th and 8th generations secure by any definition just because they have 53 fewer errata, and the older generations may have more known vulnerabilities simply because they've been around longer. So, we have a couple of generations of Intel CPUs that have security vulnerabilities, some a few more than others. Windows 11 obviously won't need CPU instructions that aren't supported by Kaby Lakes, or otherwise MS wouldn't consider supporting them. So that leaves security concerns and financial reasons as the motivation. Security, well, I think what I mentioned earlier suffices. Since Windows 11 is based on the same core as 10, performance requirements can't be a factor either. If security is Microsoft's concern and the real reason behind cutting support, they're approaching the issue in a suspicious manner.

fafhrd · Jul 1, 2021

Winuser said:
After reading some of the "users need to buy a new computer" post I'm taking the tape off of my mouth for a second to give my opinion. No one has to buy a new computer because of Windows 11 and the end of support for Windows 10 in 2025. The end of Windows 10 support in 2025 doesn't mean they won't be able to use their devices. It just means no more updates. I'm sure if they're using a security program that it will continue to get updates past the October 2025 cutoff date. The average user will be fine if they continue running Windows 10 on the systems they have now. Most users don't want or need the latest and greatest. The average user just wants a device that does what they need done. When the time comes and the average user has to buy a new device chances are it will have Windows 11 preinstalled. I also think it's time for MS to look more to the future and stop worrying about support for ancient hardware. I don't agree with were they drew the line for what devices can run Windows 11.

The reality of unsupported operating systems is that not only Microsoft does not write software that works with the deprecated OS, no third party software supports the deprecated OS for long either. Try to find Chrome, Opera or Firefox browsers for XP now, the latest versions are not compatible or do not install. It is the same for OSX on Mac, which is why I am running Windows 10, and at the moment, Windows 11 22000.51 on an iMac 9,1, which sort of fails to upgrade after OSX Mountain Lion, and next to no Mac software now runs on that old OS. So this old piece of hardware from 2009 has new life as a windows PC, see my specs below. Currently it works well.

I have to replace my Android phone every couple of years, because my banking apps no longer will run on older Android versions. Some phones cannot get efficient replacement batteries as the original ones lose efficiency, since the OEM fails to support them, and the only alternative batteries are fake products that have poor efficiency or safety. Modern phones are built without the opportunity to replace batteries - they are effectively disposable items, with built-in obsolescence.

I do not like e-waste, when devices and hardware are consigned to trash, when they still work, and e-waste recycling is far from optimal. There is no economic way to separate the parts. The cases are often of tough black plastic, often ABS, PS, and PP, which are neither easily recyclable from comminuted mixtures of materials, nor safely combusted or gasified, and it all ends up as landfill, dumped in poorer countries, or in the sea.

Within the plastic case, there is often a mild steel chassis, which may be recycled, and various electronic components soldered onto a printed circuit board. This whole mixture of components is a mix of resin, glass, silica, silicon, plastic, ferrous and nonferrous metals, and a tiny amount of precious, and rare earth metals, and some highly toxic elements. The wide spectrum of elements in e-waste make it complicated to recycle and refine the component elements., so the waste remains dumped.

Recycling is not the clean panacea that many people believe it to be. The simplest scrap materials, in many ways, are composed of ferrous metals, often mild steel. In order to refine this to a standard product, it may be necessary to first refine it to pure iron, which in one way or another requires carbon and energy, releasing carbon dioxide into the atmosphere, and using silicon from natural mined rock to produce slag to purify the iron, all these processes producing waste heat, and fossil carbon dioxide. Then the iron needs to become steel, another process requiring energy and carbon from fossil sources, and emitting more carbon dioxide.

Non ferrous metal purification is a long process of dissolving the metal mixture in acids and then precipitating out various contaminant metals, and possibly using electrolysis for final purification. Each stage is energy intensive, and the resultant waste products are toxic, and should be disposed of responsibly, some of which are gases, and require scrubbing so they do not pollute the atmosphere. Soluble toxic waste needs to be precipitated, or crystallised, in order not to pollute the environment.

jessewilliams56 · Jul 1, 2021

My desktop computer has a 4th Gen Intel CPU. It has never had a virus. So I don't think it is more prone to viruses as it has always had an active antivirus on it from Norton or McAfee.

Edit: With the above being said, it is just a sales gimmick to make people go out and buy new computers. I am sure my computer would run Windows 11 just fine without any issue.

SuperConker · Jul 1, 2021

Yeah i don't see how anyone can sit there and defend actions like this from Microsoft
(most people defending it are sadly people who have supported computers).

We have to remember that Windows 11 is just a reskin of Windows 10.
And any computer that can run Windows 10 is fully capable of running Windows 11 as-well.

What's even worse is that if you modify the Windows 11 installation-media,
Windows 11 will then suddenly run perfectly fine on older hardware.

So this is clearly only done to make money, by forcing people to buy new hardware.

And what's with people saying you don't need to upgrade to Windows 11?
Of course you will have to upgrade, eventually.

I want to upgrade to Windows 11 myself, but i am being dis-allowed by Microsoft to do so
(on a computer that far exceeds the system requirements).

And no, i don't need people who already have supported hardware telling me how i am supposed to feel about that.
Nor do i want to run Windows 10, when Windows 11 is released.

badrobot · Jul 1, 2021

lopedaddy said:
Calm down.

Just got off the phone with Supermicro and Gigabyte on the TPM thingy.

Surpermicro, TPM 2.0, type is a AOM-TPM-9665V-C(vertical mount), for the 20 pin header on my MB (MOBO Gigabyte z87x ud4h, i7 4790k processor). Supermicro could not provide any assistance on driver needed or provisioning needed for this MB. Advised to call Gigabyte.

Gigabyte call. Very informative. No TPM support for WIN 11 at this time. However, my MB and processor will be compatible with new TPM. They, gigabyte, are in the early stages to engineering and production of a compatible TPM module for Win 11. That module and all supporting software should be available at a later date for sale to general public.

If your mother board has a TPM header call your board maker for particulars imo.

07/01/2021 @ 2:16 PM
Notice from Gigabyte. Boards with socket 1150 will not support Win 11 at this time.

TPM is just one problem. Another bigger problem is supported CPUs. Intel supported CPU starts with 8th Gen. So, our 4790K is already out.

jessewilliams56 · Jul 1, 2021

@SuperConker

I agree! You are absolutely correct. When Windows 10 support ends, it will be just as Windows XP, Vista, and also how 7 is turning out to be. The computers will go obsolete, won't work properly anymore, and eventually our antivirus programs will no longer work on it.

How do I know this? Because my grandmother had Windows XP. She loved it, but the computer didn't work properly anymore after the support had ended for antivirus and updates, so she had no choice but to buy a new desktop computer with Windows 10. She is slowly learning 10 still. I have to help her from time to time with it when she messes something up.

badrobot · Jul 1, 2021

jessewilliams56 said:
@SuperConker

I agree! You are absolutely correct. When Windows 10 support ends, it will be just as Windows XP, Vista, and also how 7 is turning out to be. The computers will go obsolete, won't work properly anymore, and eventually our antivirus programs will no longer work on it.

How do I know this? Because my grandmother had Windows XP. She loved it, but the computer didn't work properly anymore after the support had ended for antivirus and updates, so she had no choice but to buy a new desktop computer with Windows 10. She is slowly learning 10 still. I have to help her from time to time with it when she messes something up.

Put Classic Shell on it so it will look very familiar for her... :)

Stigg · Jul 1, 2021

Has anyone tried WinPass11?

WinPass11 (GitHub)
GitHub Releases.

jh30uk · Jul 1, 2021

"Our goal is for the end-user to easily run a single executable and have access to Windows 11 through the dev channel without having to worry about unsupported hardware. This program supports bypassing all of the Windows 11 requirements!"

Dev channel is allowed for all anyhow if you are already on it, unsure if you can swap if lower spec.

bobkn · Jul 2, 2021

SuperConker said:
Yeah i don't see how anyone can sit there and defend actions like this from Microsoft
(most people defending it are sadly people who have supported computers).

We have to remember that Windows 11 is just a reskin of Windows 10.
And any computer that can run Windows 10 is fully capable of running Windows 11 as-well.

What's even worse is that if you modify the Windows 11 installation-media,
Windows 11 will then suddenly run perfectly fine on older hardware.

So this is clearly only done to make money, by forcing people to buy new hardware.

And what's with people saying you don't need to upgrade to Windows 11?
Of course you will have to upgrade, eventually.

I want to upgrade to Windows 11 myself, but i am being dis-allowed by Microsoft to do so
(on a computer that far exceeds the system requirements).

And no, i don't need people who already have supported hardware telling me how i am supposed to feel about that.
Nor do i want to run Windows 10, when Windows 11 is released.

The security features required by Microsoft for Windows 11 are present in Windows 10. MS just didn't require them to be supported by hardware to run 10 in 2015, or since.

That's not to defend MS, or condemn them. I have no idea how significant UEFI, Secure Boot, TPM, and Core Isolation are for future security. I think that MS is doing a poor job in explaining their new requirements.

I believe that they also didn't foresee the number of people who would claim that 11 is not significantly different from 10, but who are still angry that they are barred from 11.

(I don't claim any wisdom of my own. I'm running 22000.51 myself, 99% pointlessly.)

davidvkimball · Jul 2, 2021

Stigg said:
Has anyone tried WinPass11?

WinPass11 (GitHub)
GitHub Releases.

Good find, I'm also curious if this works for people.

jen1 · Jul 2, 2021

i486 said:
Well alright then. Not that that makes the 7th and 8th generations secure by any definition just because they have 53 fewer errata, and the older generations may have more known vulnerabilities simply because they've been around longer. So, we have a couple of generations of Intel CPUs that have security vulnerabilities, some a few more than others. Windows 11 obviously won't need CPU instructions that aren't supported by Kaby Lakes, or otherwise MS wouldn't consider supporting them. So that leaves security concerns and financial reasons as the motivation. Security, well, I think what I mentioned earlier suffices. Since Windows 11 is based on the same core as 10, performance requirements can't be a factor either. If security is Microsoft's concern and the real reason behind cutting support, they're approaching the issue in a suspicious manner.

OMG! Still not convinced?

It is not about how many errata, it is that the 6th gen has a different architecture than the 7th and the 8th gen.

For you all, if you have a vulnerable hardware that doesn't mean you can't install Windows 11, on the contrary you will be more vulnerable if you still using windows 10, i think it is more advised to update to windows 11 if you have unsupported hardware LOL.

jessewilliams56 · Jul 2, 2021

@jen1 but the problem is, Microsoft will probably block the upgrade from happening to Windows 11 from Windows 10 if they have unsupported hardware. The only way around it, is as others have mentioned, provide a workaround, hack, etc. to get it to go through. Microsoft just wants people to buy new computers. It is just a money making thing. Microsoft doesn't care about their customers. They care about the money from their customers.

Joan Archer · Jul 2, 2021

Well space would prevent me from installing it on this HP. I have a 128GB SSD and a 1TB HD in it and I have everything I can have on the Data drive which still has plenty of room but the SSD drive only has about 26GB of free space left.

Mind you I like as much as possible to be up to date with new technology but can't always afford to get it when it first comes out. I did get 7 and 10 when they were new but the machines I had at the time were capable of running them with no problems but 11 could prove to be a little problematic on the laptop I have at present, I bought it at the end of December 2017 so I'm ready to treat myself to a new machine, just have to find one that I can afford that will run the new OS. :)

badrobot · Jul 2, 2021

jessewilliams56 said:
@jen1 but the problem is, Microsoft will probably block the upgrade from happening to Windows 11 from Windows 10 if they have unsupported hardware. The only way around it, is as others have mentioned, provide a workaround, hack, etc. to get it to go through. Microsoft just wants people to buy new computers. It is just a money making thing. Microsoft doesn't care about their customers. They care about the money from their customers.

The worst thing can happen is that microsoft will release a different Windows 11 version for unsupported systems.

NavyLCDR · Jul 2, 2021

jessewilliams56 said:
@jen1 but the problem is, Microsoft will probably block the upgrade from happening to Windows 11 from Windows 10 if they have unsupported hardware. The only way around it, is as others have mentioned, provide a workaround, hack, etc. to get it to go through. Microsoft just wants people to buy new computers. It is just a money making thing. Microsoft doesn't care about their customers. They care about the money from their customers.

If you remember when Windows 10 first rolled out, many computers were not offered the upgrade via Windows update due to incompatible hardware. Thousands of users simply downloaded the ISO file and updated with it and then were in the normal Windows 10 update cycle. Even now many users don't get feature upgrades via Windows Update and simply download the new ISO file and upgrade that way. I expect Windows 11 will be no different. I think there is way too much concern and hype surrounding "unsupported hardware".

Mark Phelps · Jul 2, 2021

jh30uk said:
"Our goal is for the end-user to easily run a single executable and have access to Windows 11 through the dev channel without having to worry about unsupported hardware. This program supports bypassing all of the Windows 11 requirements!"

Dev channel is allowed for all anyhow if you are already on it, unsure if you can swap if lower spec.

Sorry -- not true!! How do I know? Simple -- my PC is on the Win10 Dev channel and WILL NOT install the Win11 preview due to enforced hardware constraints -- specifically, TPM and Secure Boot. I know what MS said in their announcement -- and that is simply a lie. I've also seen claims that folks trying to join the Insider Dev ring, but with incompatible hardware, are being refused. So, despite what MS said, this is not true.

jh30uk · Jul 2, 2021

Take it up with MS not me, I posted that screenie multiple times that shows what is what.

WXC · Jul 2, 2021

NavyLCDR said:
If you remember when Windows 10 first rolled out, many computers were not offered the upgrade via Windows update due to incompatible hardware. Thousands of users simply downloaded the ISO file and updated with it and then were in the normal Windows 10 update cycle. Even now many users don't get feature upgrades via Windows Update and simply download the new ISO file and upgrade that way. I expect Windows 11 will be no different. I think there is way too much concern and hype surrounding "unsupported hardware".

Hello, sir.

You nailed it. :wink:

Best regards.

Superfly · Jul 2, 2021

Seems it's only applicable to in-place upgrades...

It applies these reg settings (to enable dev channel, bypass h/w tpm/enable boot)

Code:

Windows Registry Editor Version 5.00

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsSelfHost\Applicability]
"BranchName"="Dev"
"Ring"="External"
"ContentType"="Mainline"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\WindowsSelfHost\UI\Selection]
"UIContentType"="Mainline"
"UIBranch"="Dev"
"UIRing"="External"

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\Setup\LabConfig]
"BypassTPMCheck"=dword:00000001
"BypassSecureBootCheck"=dword:00000001

then downloads "AppraiserRes.dll" and overwrites the existing in "C:\$WINDOWS.~BT\Sources\" (yes hard-coded drive letter

)

...and runs WU at certain intervals.

Not sure I'm keen on their files being downloaded to my system but anyway - also it uses System.Diagnostics.ProcessStartInfo (Windows Defender doesn't like that sort of thing - won't be surprised if it gets blocked.

Note: I just viewed the source code - I did not run it, so not sure if it works or not.