Solved A little help finding backup software

hdmi · Jan 26, 2023

BrianS said:
Well as one door closes another one slams in your face.
In attempting to follow good advice I found that I cant create a Recovery Environment (RE) cos the partition file is not on my drive. I suspect that when I ug from W10 to 11 that this got lost - this happens it seems. So far no attempts with CMD tools have restored this file. Well done Microsoft , dumped customer leaving him stranded again.
Aomei free seems to promise the solution?
It comes back to my full disc clone option which is the least flexible but seems the simplest. But what do I know

How to Use and Repair Windows Recovery Environment (WinRE) on Windows 10? | Windows OS Hub

Windows Recovery Environment (WinRE) is the minimal OS based on Windows Preinstallation Environment (WinPE) which includes a number of tools to repair, reset and diagnose Windows. If the main host…

woshub.com

BrianS · Jan 26, 2023

Pass me the speculum Nurse Robin, Im gonna open her up. Is that wise Dr B you've never been down there before, what can go wrong. Could she freeze up and not respond to you anymore - they can do this, its in their nature - its how Microsoft Almighty created the kit.

Death where is thy sting - cant do the final logout,

Google Acounts dont recognise my password

hdmi · Jan 26, 2023

BrianS said:
Pass me the speculum Nurse Robin, Im gonna open her up. Is that wise Dr B you've never been down there before, what can go wrong. Could she freeze up and not respond to you anymore - they can do this, its in their nature - its how Microsoft Almighty created the kit.

Death where is thy sting - cant do the final logout, Google Acounts dont recognise my password

BrianS · Jan 26, 2023

SIW2 said:
copy the windows\system32\recovery folder out of the installation media into your windows\system32 folder using 7-zip

I dont have any installation media. My m/c came with OEM W10 installed (I battled to find the product code when ug to W11). Windows.old now deleted by Microsoft

hdmi · Jan 26, 2023

BrianS said:
I dont have any installation media. My m/c came with OEM W10 installed (I battled to find the product code when ug to W11). Windows.old now deleted by Microsoft

Download Official Windows 11 ISO file from Microsoft Tutorial

Microsoft provides ISO files for Windows 11 to download. You can use these ISO files to clean install or in-place upgrade Windows 11. This tutorial will show you how to download an official Windows 11 ISO file from Microsoft. The Flight Hub can also help you keep updated on which Windows 11...

www.elevenforum.com

jimbo45 · Jan 26, 2023

@BrianS

Also plenty of isos available from UUPDUMP. Choose version of windows you want, run the script and the iso should be created easily enough.

Cheers
jimbo

BrianS · Jan 26, 2023

I am looking to get a duplicate used Acer xc885 as a sandbox to try out all these nerdy things. You techies love doing risky things and shouldnt be allowed to talk dirty near us children. We can the wrong idea and end up with a brick, then spend shed load of money down the repair shop full of techies who tell us (like a doctor) not to trust the web. But I feel I gotta get some competence in this area of managing my pc and keeping control. At least I wont risk my main m/c (that would really leave me in deep No2's)

kado897 · Jan 26, 2023

BrianS said:
I am looking to get a duplicate used Acer xc885 as a sandbox to try out all these nerdy things. You techies love doing risky things and shouldnt be allowed to talk dirty near us children. We can the wrong idea and end up with a brick, then spend shed load of money down the repair shop full of techies who tell us (like a doctor) not to trust the web. But I feel I gotta get some competence in this area of managing my pc and keeping control. At least I wont risk my main m/c (that would really leave me in deep No2's)

Probably a good idea.

BrianS · Jan 26, 2023

In browsing around for an alt pc test bed, I was surprised to discover that some pcs can be disastrously slow. I already discovered that on my pathetic little Lenovo laptop W10. I already know that 16G ram is essential and cheap enough to add an extra 8G.
Example in Mazon Amazon.co.uk:Customer reviews: Acer Aspire XC-830 Desktop PC - (Intel Pentium J5040D, 4GB, 1TB HDD, USB Keyboard and Mouse, Windows 10, Black).
So slow and unfit for purpose, customers returned in disgust - yet still being offered for sale

Buddy · Jan 26, 2023

OK, progress report. I've set up a batch jobs for Free File Sync. This was preceded by copying all the data to be backed up with File Explorer, so that all FFS has to do is update changes.

The first batch job backs up a bunch of stuff to my primary desktop USB HDD. It's set up to do versioning, so that when FFS deletes older versions, it keeps them for a user-specified time. This one runs hourly. I'd hoped to maybe run it at longer intervals or specified times of day, but that would require separate Task Scheduler jobs for each backup due to limitations of Task Scheduler. Keeping it simple, there's just one that repeats. NBD, as the hourly runs are usually quite small and quick.

The second batch job just maintains a copy of the backups on the primary HDD on a second desktop USB HDD. No versioning local to this drive, as the versioning on the primary is just copied along with the data. This HDD is my protection against the unlikely event that I lose both the laptop C: SSD and the desktop USB HDD.

For offsite backup, the next job will be to use FFS to replicate the backups on Google Drive, as an upload rather than a synch. I.e. to "My Drive" rather than to "My Laptop". I'm really tickled that FFS can handle the G:\ drive alias for Google Drive as a target or source. I'll probably get this one set up in the next day or two, after the first two batch jobs mature and prove themselves.

Finally, I'll create a "road drive" job to push backups to either a big USB stick or my 2TB portable USB HDD. This will only run manually as needed to either prep the portable data for a road trip or to back up while on the road.

This process hits every single one of my wish list targets in the original post. It's not turnkey like a commercial package, but it's not at all tough to master FFS and Task Scheduler. FFS has a lot of flexibility. One aspect I found valuable is being able to run a sync job manually from inside either FFS or Task Scheduler. That was a big help in proving out the setup for the batch jobs.

Maybe it's a bit of overkill, but I've always felt a little exposed by my much simpler backup on my old PC that this one replaces.

After a bit of a breather and doing some more reading, I'll tackle an image backup routine. That will require another tool. Initial impressions are that Macrium is well regarded, but I'm open to suggestions for a leaner and more focused tool, after the success of FFS.

I'm still really inexperienced in the backup world, so thoughts, anyone?

And finally, thanks again to @kado897 for mentioning FreeFileSync. The more I use it, the more I like it.

kado897 · Jan 27, 2023

Buddy said:
OK, progress report. I've set up a batch jobs for Free File Sync. This was preceded by copying all the data to be backed up with File Explorer, so that all FFS has to do is update changes.

The first batch job backs up a bunch of stuff to my primary desktop USB HDD. It's set up to do versioning, so that when FFS deletes older versions, it keeps them for a user-specified time. This one runs hourly. I'd hoped to maybe run it at longer intervals or specified times of day, but that would require separate Task Scheduler jobs for each backup due to limitations of Task Scheduler. Keeping it simple, there's just one that repeats. NBD, as the hourly runs are usually quite small and quick.

The second batch job just maintains a copy of the backups on the primary HDD on a second desktop USB HDD. No versioning local to this drive, as the versioning on the primary is just copied along with the data. This HDD is my protection against the unlikely event that I lose both the laptop C: SSD and the desktop USB HDD.

For offsite backup, the next job will be to use FFS to replicate the backups on Google Drive, as an upload rather than a synch. I.e. to "My Drive" rather than to "My Laptop". I'm really tickled that FFS can handle the G:\ drive alias for Google Drive as a target or source. I'll probably get this one set up in the next day or two, after the first two batch jobs mature and prove themselves.

Finally, I'll create a "road drive" job to push backups to either a big USB stick or my 2TB portable USB HDD. This will only run manually as needed to either prep the portable data for a road trip or to back up while on the road.

This process hits every single one of my wish list targets in the original post. It's not turnkey like a commercial package, but it's not at all tough to master FFS and Task Scheduler. FFS has a lot of flexibility. One aspect I found valuable is being able to run a sync job manually from inside either FFS or Task Scheduler. That was a big help in proving out the setup for the batch jobs.

Maybe it's a bit of overkill, but I've always felt a little exposed by my much simpler backup on my old PC that this one replaces.

After a bit of a breather and doing some more reading, I'll tackle an image backup routine. That will require another tool. Initial impressions are that Macrium is well regarded, but I'm open to suggestions for a leaner and more focused tool, after the success of FFS.

I'm still really inexperienced in the backup world, so thoughts, anyone?

And finally, thanks again to @kado897 for mentioning FreeFileSync. The more I use it, the more I like it.

Good to have another user. BTW you can also double click the batch file to run it.

Buddy · Jan 27, 2023

kado897 said:
Good to have another user. BTW you can also double click the batch file to run it.

Side note - I've sent FFS a good-sized donation. Hoping the creators are able to sustain support for it.

hdmi · Jan 27, 2023

Buddy said:
I'm still really inexperienced in the backup world, so thoughts, anyone?

Syncing your data is not the same thing as having a reliable backup strategy. As long as the storage device that contains the copied data is not physically disconnected from everything also including the computer, the wall outlet, network devices and all other devices, it is still vulnerable. In addition to this, as long as this storage device is not moved to a safe location away from the computer, it is still vulnerable. Also in addition to this, as long as the integrity of this storage device is not validated on a regular basis, it is still vulnerable, and, you can't validate it unless you reconnect it. So, once reconnected, it will be exposed to the aforementioned types of risks again, for only just a limited period of time, yes, but this will be on a regular basis. Therefore, I use multiple USB3 HDDs (all 3.5 inch) and use them such a way that all the important ones are moved to the safe location away from the computer first, always BEFORE one of these will be allowed to be moved to the computer. Always always. But a safe location away from the computer still doesn't make it 100% safe.

There exist several ways to keep extra backups off site. Cloud services are a good example of this, but these also have various shortcomings. That's why you should consider to use multiple ones. Especially for your most important data, you should. Then again, there might be some concerns with privacy and security (data leaks) related to this. You can use data encryption to protect what you upload to the cloud. But Encryption can also be vulnerable for a variety of reasons. As time passes, Brute Force attacks become more prominent gradually, and, due to technological advancements in quantum computing, this has grown to be another serious weakness. Because, once your encrypted data is in the hands of a company like Google, there is no easy way to predict what they might do with it at some point in the future. If the data we're talking about here will have lost most of its value before they crack the encryption, then sure. Just I wouldn't count on that too much. A little bit maybe. I'll leave most of that to the nerds who keep repeating that it's safe. 😇

Buddy · Jan 27, 2023

@hdmi All good things to think about. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond - thanks.

In light of your comments, I'm OK with the roles of my locally attached drives and what their limitations are. I've got a quality surge protector, not something from the big box store. And leaning toward putting in a small UPS to further isolate things.

Other than Quicken, there's nothing I'm putting on Google Drive of any use to anyone but me, so I'm not terribly uncomfortable about its limitations. And maybe I'll work out a plan B for Quicken.

You've given me a good reason to rethink the role of my portable drive(s). Originally, I was just thinking of them as a way to carry my full backup when I travel, in the event the house is broken into or burns. In the original plan, the only off-site storage was cloud. Your comments have now got me trying to figure out the best way to keep one outside the house all the time, whether I'm travelling or not. Completely off the property would be best, but I work from home, so there's not a separate place of work.

I'm mulling the possibilities of keeping one in the car. That brings its own set of worries. First is summer heat when parked. The other is that car break-ins are rampant here. Smash a window and rummage through the console and glove box. I think as long as I use an odd storage location (say, under the floor mat) that won't be a big risk, because these aren't pros and they act pretty quickly. Gonna have to stew on that one a bit.

hdmi · Jan 27, 2023

Buddy said:
@hdmi All good things to think about. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond - thanks.

In light of your comments, I'm OK with the roles of my locally attached drives and what their limitations are. I've got a quality surge protector, not something from the big box store. And leaning toward putting in a small UPS to further isolate things.

Other than Quicken, there's nothing I'm putting on Google Drive of any use to anyone but me, so I'm not terribly uncomfortable about its limitations. And maybe I'll work out a plan B for Quicken.

You've given me a good reason to rethink the role of my portable drive(s). Originally, I was just thinking of them as a way to carry my full backup when I travel, in the event the house is broken into or burns. In the original plan, the only off-site storage was cloud. Your comments have now got me trying to figure out the best way to keep one outside the house all the time, whether I'm travelling or not. Completely off the property would be best, but I work from home, so there's not a separate place of work.

I'm mulling the possibilities of keeping one in the car. That brings its own set of worries. First is summer heat when parked. The other is that car break-ins are rampant here. Smash a window and rummage through the console and glove box. I think as long as I use an odd storage location (say, under the floor mat) that won't be a big risk, because these aren't pros and they act pretty quickly. Gonna have to stew on that one a bit.

Not all surge protectors are created equal of course, but even the best quality ones can still fail, and electrical type of failures of the storage controller can still wipe out multiple storage devices at once when all are attached to it through the data cables so, it isn't just about the power supply connections. I have watched entire RAID arrays go up in smoke with just a single spark. A single motherboard can also wipe out multiple hardware controllers at once if it fails. Controllers with extra protections against this are naturally expensive, and these protection mechanisms can still fail. It doesn't protect against other types of risks like hacker or virus attacks, software errors, user errors and other unexpected risks or various accidents. You can get enclosures (NAS or directly attached through USB, etc.) with multiple removable drive bays like caddies or sleds, and these days a lot of these enclosures also have USB ports on them, but in the end the drives are still at risk until you actually decide to start using these features that make them removable, and start to use them properly─which many do not.

If you know someone you can trust and who lives in another building, then you could set up a secure VPN connection, as moving a few storage devices back and forth between your building and a vault may not always prove to be feasible and/or practical. But if you use BitLocker drive encryption or similar to protect the data from getting stolen in the possible event of a burglary taking place after the computer has been turned off, then also keep in mind that this particular part of the equation also introduces a whole additional new set of complex criteria to worry about. When I first started reading up on the subject of how, over the past several years, BitLocker has been evolving, immediately it struck me that you can't really depend on BitLocker outside of an enterprise environment where it can be useful only due to being in restricted access areas behind physical locked doors with the kind of supervision that almost none of the small companies are capable to afford. Not a lot of Windows users seem to be adequately aware of how this all works (or factually I should say: how this all doesn't work).

Buddy · Jan 29, 2023

More progress.

I've now got cloud backup, a first for me. Copied all the backed-up files from my primary desktop backup drive, including the version history, to Google Drive. Yall, it takes a while to upload 140GB on a 500mbps fiber connection. Confirmed that the contents there match the desktop drive. Set up a FreeFileSync batch file to keep the Google Drive versions current. Set up a task in Task Scheduler to run this update once each day, at the end of the day. Ran a test manually to confirm that it all works correctly, then confirmed that last night's scheduled run went as hoped.

I'd posted earlier that my main backups to my primary backup drive were set hourly, because that was the longest Task Scheduler offered for a repeat time. Now, I've poked around and learned that Task Scheduler will let you define multiple triggers for a single task. So, I've trimmed he intra-day backups to a more reasonable number. With FFS only moving changes, these happen quite quickly.

I downloaded, but haven't installed, Macrium 8 Home. There will be a separate thread about that.

Left to do:
-FreeFileSync batch job to prep my "road backup" portable HDD before each trip. Basically bring it to current backup. Run as needed.
-FreeFileSync batch job for "on the road" backups to portable HDD. Probably run manually. Not quite the same content as the "prep".

And finally:
-Install and set up Macrium
-Set up "offsite" removable (and bootable?) HDD or SSD to include Macrium images and file backups

From a starting point as a near-complete backup novice, things are moving. Of course, I have a lot yet to learn, but I'm already way more backed up than the old computer ever was.

kado897 · Jan 29, 2023

Good progress. Can you link the MR thread when you set it up?

Buddy · Jan 29, 2023

kado897 said:
Good progress. Can you link the MR thread when you set it up?

Will do. It will start out like this one did, as a noob's plea for guidance.

BrianS · Jan 29, 2023

Buddy said:
Will do. It will start out like this one did, as a noob's plea for guidance.

yup I'll be watching you. waiting to get my sandbox m/c set up to go down a similar route

hdmi · Jan 29, 2023

Buddy said:
I'd posted earlier that my main backups to my primary backup drive were set hourly, because that was the longest Task Scheduler offered for a repeat time. Now, I've poked around and learned that Task Scheduler will let you define multiple triggers for a single task. So, I've trimmed he intra-day backups to a more reasonable number.

You can change the repeat time from 1 hour to 4 hours by simply typing in 4 hours

EDIT: Typing in 150 min. also works

Solved A little help finding backup software

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