File properties / metadata - NTFS and FAT32


Into_Oblivion1

Into_Oblivion1

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Hello

1.
NTFS
The file properties / metadata, are part of the file?
Is the file properties / metadata stored together with the file / on the same cluster as the file?

2.
FAT32
The file properties / metadata, are part of the file?
Is the file properties / metadata stored together with the file / on the same cluster as the file?

Thank you
 
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Can anyone help me with this?

Thank you
 

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Into_Oblivion1 said:
NTFS
The file properties / metadata, are part of the file?
Is the file properties / metadata stored together with the file / on the same cluster as the file?
Click to expand...
No. File metadata is stored in the Master File Table, or non-resident clusters tied to the MFT.
No. File clusters only contain file data.

A tiny file (< 900 bytes) might be stored directly inside the MFT as an embedded data object, rather than exist outside as a standalone file cluster. NTFS can save space by not assigning an entire disk block to something that won't fill it. Once the file grows too large, it gets promoted to its own file cluster outside of the MFT. Extent-based filesystems on Linux do a similar trick.

Into_Oblivion1 said:
FAT32
The file properties / metadata, are part of the file?
Is the file properties / metadata stored together with the file / on the same cluster as the file?
Click to expand...
No. Stored in the FAT32.
No.
 
Last edited:

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Meta data that is stored in the filesystem is one thing and the files internal meta data is another.
Filesystem meta data get lost if copied between two incompatible filesystems as from to NTFS to ext4 and then back to NTFS again.
In a photo where it says model of camera, GPS coordinates etc. is in the file it self and will still be intact.. otherwise cleaning photo meta data would just to copy the file between two incompatible filesystems
 

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Marie SWE said:
.. otherwise cleaning photo meta data would just to copy the file between two incompatible filesystems
Click to expand...
ITYM otherwise copying the file between two incompatible filesystems would clean the photo metadata
 

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Marie SWE said:
otherwise cleaning photo meta data would just to copy the file between two incompatible filesystems
Click to expand...

mngerhold said:
ITYM otherwise copying the file between two incompatible filesystems would clean the photo metadata
Click to expand...
Or i could have
otherwise cleaning the photo meta data would just to copy the file between two incompatible filesystems.

But english is only my second language i started to learn 2018.. So... yeah i do mess up now and then on the grammar... Do you? and how long have you known english?
 

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Photo metadata, when created by a device (camera, smartphone, Adobe suite) as the EXIF header, is directly embedded in a photo file. Transferring from different filesystems and platforms wouldn't strip that data.

Windows metadata like "Rate this picture" is stored as NTFS alternative streams, and isn't supported outside of NTFS.
 

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EDIT: I see that in the meantime, Garlin also referenced the alternate data streams. Man, you can't get anything past him :-)

This is not used extensively, but some things can also get stored in an "alternate data stream". The one thing that I know that does make use of this is the flagging of some files downloaded from the Internet. For example, have you ever looked at the properties of a file and seen a checkbox to unblock the file? That info is stored in an alternate data stream.

I downloaded a .reg file from one of Brink's tutorials. Below are the properties for that file:

Image1.webp

I've used this in the past to store info about some files but this has to be used with caution because it can easily be stripped off.
 

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HFS on older Macs supported "resource forks" (same idea), but after they switched to UNIX, per-file metadata is stored in "dot" files. If you've ever extracted an archive file of a photos folder from a Mac, you get a bunch of extra files that look weird on Windows.
 

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Marie SWE said:
Or i could have
otherwise cleaning the photo meta data would just to copy the file between two incompatible filesystems.

But english is only my second language i started to learn 2018.. So... yeah i do mess up now and then on the grammar... Do you? and how long have you known english?
Click to expand...
You could write the words in many different orders, but they won't all mean the same. I am not criticising your english, only making a suggestion for the benefit of others who may not be able to work out what you meant.

Of course I mess up - there are probably typos in this. And all my life.
 

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mngerhold said:
You could write the words in many different orders, but they won't all mean the same. I am not criticising your english, only making a suggestion for the benefit of others who may not be able to work out what you meant.

Of course I mess up - there are probably typos in this. And all my life.
Click to expand...
i actually dont think anyone can misinterpret the meaning of my mess... Butt feel free to rewrite my hole post to correct US or UK grammar, so the whole post become coherent instead of split posts.
 

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Marie SWE said:
Filesystem meta data get lost if copied between two incompatible filesystems as from to NTFS to ext4 and then back to NTFS again.
Click to expand...
I have copied a file from NTFS > FAT32 > NTFS again
And the file retained its original "Modified" timestamp
 

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garlin said:
No. File metadata is stored in the Master File Table, or non-resident clusters tied to the MFT.
No. File clusters only contain file data.

No. Stored in the FAT32.
No.
Click to expand...
Files copied between the two systems, do they retain their filesystem metadata?
 

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Another question:

3.
How many timestamps for each of "Created" "Modifed" "Accessed" does a filesystem store?
Only 1, and it just get overwritten by the filesystem?
 

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Into_Oblivion1 said:
Files copied between the two systems, do they retain their filesystem metadata?
Click to expand...
They retain the basic file metadata which they have in common (timestamps, ownership, permissions, attributes).
 

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Regarding journaling:

NTFS journaling is a feature of the New Technology File System (NTFS) that ensures file system integrity by recording metadata changes in a transaction log before they are actually made.
–
No, NTFS journaling is not part of the Master File Table (MFT); rather, it is a separate, but related,
–
So I can conclude, that the NTFS journaling will not follow the file:
If the file is copied on the same drive?
If the file is copied to another drive?

Regarding NTFS MFT entry modified:

An NTFS “MFT Entry Modified” (or $Mft Modified) timestamp changes whenever the actual Master File Table (MFT) record for a file or directory is altered. This happens during operations like creating, deleting, renaming, moving, copying, or making any change to the file’s content or metadata, such as altering its size.

Does NTFS MFT entry modified timestamp follow the file:
If the file is copied on the same drive?
If the file is copied to another drive?
 

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Could anyone help me with my remaining questions?

Thank you

Regarding journaling:

NTFS journaling is a feature of the New Technology File System (NTFS) that ensures file system integrity by recording metadata changes in a transaction log before they are actually made.
–
No, NTFS journaling is not part of the Master File Table (MFT); rather, it is a separate, but related,
–
So I can conclude, that the NTFS journaling will not follow the file:
If the file is copied on the same drive?
If the file is copied to another drive?

Regarding NTFS MFT entry modified:

An NTFS “MFT Entry Modified” (or $Mft Modified) timestamp changes whenever the actual Master File Table (MFT) record for a file or directory is altered. This happens during operations like creating, deleting, renaming, moving, copying, or making any change to the file’s content or metadata, such as altering its size.

Is there only 1 MFT entry timestamp for a file?

Does NTFS MFT entry modified timestamp follow the file:
If the file is copied on the same drive?
If the file is copied to another drive?
 

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Anyone can help me with my remaining questions above?
Or is it too tech savvy / advanced?

Thank you
 

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garlin said:
Is there a point to the endless round of questions? I suggest you purchase or find a copy of these two books in your local library:


Those are the most technical references you're going to get as an outsider.
Click to expand...
Thank you for your input

I had hoped to save some time, and someone knowledgeable on this forum could help me out
 

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