Why should I choose Macrium Reflect?

TheMystic · Dec 13, 2021

DigitalGoat said:
Nearly every connected device harvests some personal data, TVs, PCs, phones, cars, printers... the list goes on, then nearly all apps harvest data, from office style to games and websites, and most "punch" holes in firewalls without asking permission.

The idea is to limit what apps can do, as much as possible. The computer is one tech that holds personal files unlike TVs Printers, etc. So one has to be a little more careful about giving apps permissions.

Not all apps create firewall rules or override user rules. So you can't make a generalized statement like that. One has to be cautious with programs that do.

hdmi · Dec 13, 2021

TheMystic said:
Let me guess: are you using Acronis True Image?

I only use the bootable ISO of it, though. With Ventoy, that is.

jaree1961 · Dec 13, 2021

As the OP has stated his preference and whilst not directly saying it, IMO the carefully worded context of the whole post is aimed squarely at Macium and the less than apparent short comings without a full knowledge or a comprehensive review of the product.
When making comparisons of the good, bad and the ugly, carefully listing the correct pros and cons for whatever is being reviewed need to be clearly listed.
But all that being said, I like Macrium because:-
1. Yes, you can get the program to install offline (like others have stated)
2. I prefer GUI over command line, and from my experience less chance for going off track and having issues
3. The program size is not large IMO, and very hard to judge as the OP never listed what competition is being referred to
4. You can turn the background service OFF if you are that worried
5. Pretty sure most programs need access to the internet these days, and one that allows heaps of connections is Windows itself without asking you, so mute argument IMO
6. It has never let me down
7. Questions can be answered easily as a lot of ppl use it and are willing to offer assistance in various forums (particularly here) and yes @Ghot quick reference is brilliant
8. The FREE version does more than I will ever need of the program
9. Is it the best, well each and every program has its limitations and their unique things that they can do and how they do, but IMO, Yes it is the best for what I need and the price $0.00

pparks1 · Dec 13, 2021

TheMystic said:
Hello community!

As an average (or above average) user myself, I have some experience in installing/ restoring Windows, doing a backup, etc. People have a natural preference for GUI over command line. But there are many who prefer built-in utilities to 3rd party solutions for multiple reasons:

1. Built-in utilities are good enough.
2. 3rd party solutions can be a privacy risk.
3. 3rd party solutions can be a security risk.
4. 3rd party solutions can be a resource hog.

In this context, let's look at the pros and cons of a very popular program - Macrium Reflect!

I have hardly used this program, but I do have some initial impressions:

1. I don't like the fact that they don't give you the link to download the actual program. They only give you an installer link, which then downloads the program for you. This itself raises a few questions on privacy.

2. The program size is very big compared to competition.

3. The program runs a mandatory background service.

4. The program punches a hole for an incoming connection in Windows Firewall, without your knowledge.

The above reasons are good enough for me to look at it skeptically.

Since I haven't used this program much, I would like to hear specific benefits of this program over others. If you love this program, please list the exact things you use it for, and why this is the best among competition.

Here, I'll post why I don't really need Macrium Reflect for doing my system backups:

I prefer to have my system images as an ISO for the following reasons:

1. Just two commands (in Windows Terminal/ Command Prompt/ PowerShell/ Deployment Tools from Windows ADK ) are required. It is extremely easy to copy and paste those commands. The 1st command generates the image.wim file and the 2nd command creates an ISO using the same file. You need to have files from an installation disk for the 2nd command though, and that is just about 700 MB in size.

2. It can be installed in a Virtual Machine (VM).

3. It can be installed in an external disk (only Sysprep Generalized images will be bootable though on other computers).

4. I can extract the install.wim file from the ISO and use DISM to install/ restore the image on my system. No 3rd party utilities required. And no need to nuke the whole disk which happens if one were to use 3rd party utilties like Rufus or WinToUSB.

The built-in Windows System Image utility is good for the most part, but comes with limitations:

1. It can only be restored if partitions on your disk have not changed since the image was taken. If you force a restore, you will lose your existing partitions and the data in them.
2. It can only be used on the source machine that was imaged.

The default Recovery Disk created using built-in utilities is good enough to get your system up and running if you have an image backup like the one described above. If you have a working Recovery partition, then the Recovery Disk isn't even required.

Since I haven't used the program extensively, I may be missing something. I am interested in the following:

1. What are your reasons to choose Macrium Reflect despite the above?
2. What can Macrium Reflect do that built-in utilities can't?
3. Why do you think Macrium Reflect is the best among competition?

Thanks.

1). The stub file is fine with me. I can keep it on hand and then choose to download and get the latest version. And I can choose what I want to download with the stub file...for example...I often don't want to download the PE files

2). I have terabytes of space, don't really care about the size of my backup program as long as it works. Most times I don't even install it onto the computer, I just boot from the recovery media and image to my external hard drive.

3). Have lots of services running on my computer. What's one more. Have plenty of CPU and RAM to run a service for something that does something as critical as take my backups for me.

I like Macrium because
1). A lot of us use it and we can get help from each other
2). I can boot and run it from a USB rescue media without installing anything
3). I can mount my backups and pull out a single file if need be.
4). I can easily run viboot and mount the backup image
5). I've been using it free for years and the limitations are almost non-existent.
6). It simply hasn't failed me. If it's not broken, don't break it.
7). I can backup my linux machines with my bootable rescue media
8). It's easy enough to use that I can have my less technical friends install it and get a backup of their machines.

I don't really benefit whatsoever from persuading you in any way to use Macrium. I use it because it works for me. You can use whatever you are comfortable with.

TheMystic · Dec 13, 2021

Ghot said:
@TheMystic

Macrium Reflect v8 (paid), only punches holes in firewalls for 3 reasons.
Same for Macrium Reflect v7.2 (free), if I recall correctly.

To install, to update, and to rebuild the rescue media.
During install ReflectUI.exe needs internet access for one time only. After install, it can be blocked in the firewall.

The other two (reflectupdater.exe and rmbuilder.exe), need internet access when you either update MR or rebuild the rescue media. Just set these two to "blocked" until you need to use them.

Macrium Reflect runs 3 processes, and one Service.

The only backup software I've ever used that uses less, was Norton Ghost 2003.
And all it did was make backups, restore, and make the bootable media. No frills at all.

To install or update, you don't need an incoming connection in Windows Firewall. I don't know how rescue media works, but even that should be able to run with a simple outgoing connection, although I don't fully understand how that works.

Internet access is necessary for some functions, but whether an incoming connection is 'necessary', that is something I am not sure of.

TheMystic · Dec 13, 2021

Josey Wales said:
I don't believe you can do this with the Paid version as MR has your Email Address along with your key.

The paid version probably needs it for license verification, so that is understandable.

TheMystic · Dec 13, 2021

BrianInEngland said:
Pictures and documents are backed up daily to an external disk, they're not stored on the C: drive

Using Macrium Reflect?

Ghot · Dec 13, 2021

TheMystic said:
To install or update, you don't need an incoming connection in Windows Firewall. I don't know how rescue media works, but even that should be able to run with a simple outgoing connection, although I don't fully understand how that works.

Internet access is necessary for some functions, but whether an incoming connection is 'necessary', that is something I am not sure of.

Well, when you download Macrium you're only downloading a link to the program, which needs to be downloaded. Aka incoming connection.

When you update Macrium, you're downloading the update... aka incoming connection.

When you build the media you're also downloading, which is an incoming connection.

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

cereberus said:
Let's correct some errors.

1} the background service is not mandatory. I usually disable it.

2)Size is relative. If you use WinRe mode, it does not download much at all.

You have started with a very negative review but sadly have not actually tested in detail.

For example try the following (I suggest using a virtual machine)

Download the free versiom, make a backup of OS, change something, then do a restore and time it.

Then download the trial version and install that and do the same. Pick your laughing gear off the floor as you will be gobsmacked at time difference.

Now create image of main drive, and open it as a virtual machine (HyperV or virtual box). Show me how to do that using install.wim

All that stuff about security risk is just unsubstantiated nonsense. Paramount is a well respected Company with over 5 million users of Reflect (I asked them). Of all the competition, I trust them more.

Comparing the flexibility of Reflect with creating a wim is like saying I do not need a dishwasher as I can do all I need manually with a washing up bowl and squeezee pad.

Instead of asking us why most here like Reflect, why not do what I and many others on this and sister forums have done and test all the main players and find out for yourself?

For example - How many of the main packages will successfully image and restore 32GB 32bit UEFO tablets for example. I tried all the main players on my tablet and only two did that - most gave up the ghost at 32bit UEFI. Macrium Reflect was the one of the two.

On a specialist tablet forum, they had devised a very complicated way of using Linux, saying it could not be backed up with a Windows based tool. After I showed them how to do it with Reflect, deathly silence LOL.

Incidentally, look up @Kari's FFU tutorial for a much better way to make image backups with Windows than slow install.wims.

So next time you do such reviews, I suggest you test the app properly and give a properly balanced review based on proper research. I could be forgiven for thinking you are just being deliberately provocative, and frankly that is just tedious.

The description for the service states that it is necessary and should not be disabled. I guess disabling it would render the program unusable or severely limit it in functionality.

Size is relative. True. Why that is important is because it helps in comparison with other programs that do the same thing. If a program is considerably larger than others that do identical functions, it either means that the program is inefficiently coded or there is much more happening with the program than the user knows.

I haven't started with anything negative. I made it very clear that I have hardly used the program and quite possibly missing out on a lot of useful features I am unaware of. Besides, this isn't a review by any stretch of imagination.

The post explains how I do my backups and seeks to find out if there are significant advantages of using a program like Macrium Reflect, because it appears to be the favourite program for a lot of users in this forum.

You may want to ignore security and privacy risks. Not everyone does. We have ample cases of how very large organisations, many times larger than Paramount, have been found engaging in very questionable practices. I would rather be careful and cautious than be ignorant.

There is no provocation anywhere. You are simply imagining things.

DigitalGoat · Dec 14, 2021

TheMystic said:
The idea is to limit what apps can do, as much as possible. The computer is one tech that holds personal files unlike TVs Printers, etc. So one has to be a little more careful about giving apps permissions.

Not all apps create firewall rules or override user rules. So you can't make a generalized statement like that. One has to be cautious with programs that do.

The line of mine you quoted was in reference to my impression that isolating your data when it is held in any digital form seems like a never ending battle. My point being that it is easier and more effective to limit the data you have in digital form in the first place, especially if you are not "tech savvy".
Also I did not say "all apps" create or override firewall rules, I said "nearly all", and looking at a list of entries based on the number of apps I have installed "nearly all" pretty much covers it.
TVs, printers etc can all pass on personal information such as email address, device id, location information and probably a lot more besides, if not directly then through support apps for the devices, registering for warranty, updates etc.

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

jaree1961 said:
As the OP has stated his preference and whilst not directly saying it, IMO the carefully worded context of the whole post is aimed squarely at Macium and the less than apparent short comings without a full knowledge or a comprehensive review of the product.
When making comparisons of the good, bad and the ugly, carefully listing the correct pros and cons for whatever is being reviewed need to be clearly listed.
But all that being said, I like Macrium because:-
1. Yes, you can get the program to install offline (like others have stated)
2. I prefer GUI over command line, and from my experience less chance for going off track and having issues
3. The program size is not large IMO, and very hard to judge as the OP never listed what competition is being referred to
4. You can turn the background service OFF if you are that worried
5. Pretty sure most programs need access to the internet these days, and one that allows heaps of connections is Windows itself without asking you, so mute argument IMO
6. It has never let me down
7. Questions can be answered easily as a lot of ppl use it and are willing to offer assistance in various forums (particularly here) and yes @Ghot quick reference is brilliant
8. The FREE version does more than I will ever need of the program
9. Is it the best, well each and every program has its limitations and their unique things that they can do and how they do, but IMO, Yes it is the best for what I need and the price $0.00

I hold nothing against Macrium, nor should anyone who isn't competing.

1. The actual installer needs the downloader to be installed first. And that is what I don't like.

2. True. Same here.

3. I have explained what I mean by large in my previous post.

4. Haven't tried that because the service description warned against disabling it.

5. Just because the OS (Microsoft, Apple Google) have access to my data doesn't mean anyone can have a free ride with it.

Remaining points: glad to note those.

I'll probably experiment with it on a VM.

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

pparks1 said:
1). The stub file is fine with me. I can keep it on hand and then choose to download and get the latest version. And I can choose what I want to download with the stub file...for example...I often don't want to download the PE files

2). I have terabytes of space, don't really care about the size of my backup program as long as it works. Most times I don't even install it onto the computer, I just boot from the recovery media and image to my external hard drive.

3). Have lots of services running on my computer. What's one more. Have plenty of CPU and RAM to run a service for something that does something as critical as take my backups for me.

I like Macrium because
1). A lot of us use it and we can get help from each other
2). I can boot and run it from a USB rescue media without installing anything
3). I can mount my backups and pull out a single file if need be.
4). I can easily run viboot and mount the backup image
5). I've been using it free for years and the limitations are almost non-existent.
6). It simply hasn't failed me. If it's not broken, don't break it.
7). I can backup my linux machines with my bootable rescue media
8). It's easy enough to use that I can have my less technical friends install it and get a backup of their machines.

I don't really benefit whatsoever from persuading you in any way to use Macrium. I use it because it works for me. You can use whatever you are comfortable with.

The space occupied or the services that run has nothing to do with the hardware configuration of the system. It is a point to consider in the context of what they do and if they are essential for the user.

Last para:

It's completely fine even if you don't want to participate. A forum is a place where members willingly and voluntarily participate for multiple reasons. No one has an obligation.

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

Ghot said:
Well, when you download Macrium you're only downloading a link to the program, which needs to be downloaded. Aka incoming connection.

When you update Macrium, you're downloading the update... aka incoming connection.

When you build the media you're also downloading, which is an incoming connection.

When you download any of the popular browsers these days, you get a similar Downloader and not an installer. However, they don't need an incoming connection in Windows Firewall to download, install, update or run the actual program.

cereberus · Dec 14, 2021

TheMystic said:
The description for the service states that it is necessary and should not be disabled. I guess disabling it would render the program unusable or severely limit it in functionality.

Size is relative. True. Why that is important is because it helps in comparison with other programs that do the same thing. If a program is considerably larger than others that do identical functions, it either means that the program is inefficiently coded or there is much more happening with the program than the user knows.

I haven't started with anything negative. I made it very clear that I have hardly used the program and quite possibly missing out on a lot of useful features I am unaware of. Besides, this isn't a review by any stretch of imagination.

The post explains how I do my backups and seeks to find out if there are significant advantages of using a program like Macrium Reflect, because it appears to be the favourite program for a lot of users in this forum.

You may want to ignore security and privacy risks. Not everyone does. We have ample cases of how very large organisations, many times larger than Paramount, have been found engaging in very questionable practices. I would rather be careful and cautious than be ignorant.

There is no provocation anywhere. You are simply imagining things.

I have decided you are basically trolling now. Your first sentence makes guesses - why bother reply unless you have actually tried things.

1. Your guess is completely wrong.

2. Who gives a toss about size. It has a lot more features than opposition..

3. Your privacy risks points show you are being ridiculous. You can run it totally offline and never connect to internet and it still works if you are so paranoid.

Ghot · Dec 14, 2021

TheMystic said:
When you download any of the popular browsers these days, you get a similar Downloader and not an installer. However, they don't need an incoming connection in Windows Firewall to download, install, update or run the actual program.

They don't need an incoming connection to run the program. Or an outgoing one.

"Downloading" requires an incoming connection. Just like uploading, requires an outgoing connection. :)

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

Ghot said:
They don't need an incoming connection to run the program. Or an outgoing one.

"Downloading" requires an incoming connection. Just like uploading, requires an outgoing connection. :)

Can you tell me which incoming firewall connection Chrome or Firefox makes when a user installs them?

I think it is grossly incorrect to say that downloading requires an 'incoming' connection.

Ghot · Dec 14, 2021

TheMystic said:
Can you tell me which incoming firewall connection Chrome or Firefox makes when a user installs them?

This is Bitdefender firewall. The Application Access column lists ANY program that tries for internet access... either direction.
When I click on any entry in this list, it tells me the file path to the file that tried for internet access.

This is the "Rules" column. It's where I can white or blacklist a file. I use the Application Access column to determine
what rules I should set in the Rules column...

For the default Firewall setting, I have Bitdefender set to block everything.
I haven't installed Firefox for quite a while, but I believe the file that wanted access for the Firefox install, was setup.exe. It's probably
calling home to Firefox to tell them that I installed Firefox.

When in Macrium Reflect, I click on Other > Check for Updates... it doesn't work, unless I give Reflectupdater.exe, access.

I explained in post #33, which Macrium files want/need internet access, and for what reasons.

/edit

When I click "update" in Macrium, or CCleaner, or Windows or AIDA64... it sends a request over the internet to those program's servers, for the latest versions. Then those servers release those files for the programs on my computer to access and download.

When discussing installers... it depends on the installer itself. Firefox's installer is it's own program. It doesn't "need" internet access to install. Macrium is not a full program, it's just a file that knows where to "get" the Macrium program, and download it.

When I manually download a Windows Update from the Update Catalog... I don't need to be online to install that.
But if I want to just click on Windows Update... then I need an internet connection for that process to function.

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

Ghot said:
This is Bitdefender firewall. The Application Access column lists ANY program that tries for internet access... either direction.
When I click on any entry in this list, it tells me the file path to the file that tried for internet access.

View attachment 16184

This is the "Rules" column. It's where I can white or blacklist a file. I use the Application Access column to determine
what rules I should set in the Rules column...

View attachment 16185

For the default Firewall setting, I have Bitdefender set to block everything.
I haven't installed Firefox for quite a while, but I believe the file that wanted access for the Firefox install, was setup.exe. It's probably
calling home to Firefox to tell them that I installed Firefox.

When in Macrium Reflect, I click on Other > Check for Updates... it doesn't work, unless I give Reflectupdater.exe, access.

I explained in post #33, which Macrium files want/need internet access, and for what reasons.

/edit

When I click "update" in Macrium, or CCleaner, or Windows or AIDA64... it sends a request over the internet to those program's servers, for the latest versions. Then those servers release those files for the programs on my computer to access and download.

When discussing installers... it depends on the installer itself. Firefox's installer is it's own program. It doesn't "need" internet access to install. Macrium is not a full program, it's just a file that knows where to "get" the Macrium program, and download it.

When I manually download a Windows Update from the Update Catalog... I don't need to be online to install that.
But if I want to just click on Windows Update... then I need an internet connection for that process to function.

About internet access, a downloader needs internet to download files. Same holds true for updater. Both can be done with a simple rule under outgoing connections in Windows Firewall.

Here I am specifically referring to incoming connections. Chrome, Firefox, Brave, etc. all have just a downloader on their website. The downloader then downloads and installs the actual browser program just like Macrium does. However, none of them require an incoming firewall rule to work. Even if they do, you can block/ disable them and they will still run completely fine. I haven't seen them override user setting yet.

I'm certain you are wrong to say that downloading requires an incoming connection under Windows Firewall.

Ghot · Dec 14, 2021

TheMystic said:
About internet access, a downloader needs internet to download files. Same holds true for updater. Both can be done with a simple rule under outgoing connections in Windows Firewall.

Here I am specifically referring to incoming connections. Chrome, Firefox, Brave, etc. all have just a downloader on their website. The downloader then downloads and installs the actual browser program just like Macrium does. However, none of them require an incoming firewall rule to work. Even if they do, you can block/ disable them and they will still run completely fine. I haven't seen them override user setting yet.

I'm certain you are wrong to say that downloading requires an incoming connection under Windows Firewall.

Well, I don't use Windows Firewall. I thought that was clear.
In fact, I've NEVER used Windows firewall.

But I know for a fact, you need an internet connection to download the Firefox installer.

I'm also having trouble understanding what your question is.
If you just want someone to talk to... I don't type fast enought for that.

TheMystic · Dec 14, 2021

Ghot said:
Well, I don't use Windows Firewall. I thought that was clear.
In fact, I've NEVER used Windows firewall.

I figured that out.

Ghot said:
But I know for a fact, you need an internet connection to download the Firefox installer.

Isn't that obvious?

Ghot said:
I'm also having trouble understanding what your question is.
If you just want someone to talk to... I don't type fast enought for that. :)

No. But I see that most users don't seem to understand or consider potential risks. I prefer to look at things with a healthy dose of skepticism, rather than assuming or taking things for granted.