Anyone else leaving Windows 11

Lance1 · Jul 5, 2021

jimbo45 said:
Hi there....

I'm sorry Jimbo what were you saying???

PerpetualCycle · Jul 5, 2021

Lance1 said:
I'm sorry Jimbo what were you saying???

:groan: LOL

Winuser · Jul 5, 2021

I have two desktops and one laptop. All three are running the Dev build of Windows 11 and I don't see any reason to go back to Windows 10. Windows 11 is running great. If I did all three were running the Dev build of Windows 10 so I would still be a Insider. At first I was not sure that my wife's laptop would run Windows 11. I totally forgot that she has a new laptop that she bought earlier this year. I will upgrade her laptop once Windows 11 is released to the public.

BunnyJ · Jul 5, 2021

JohnMarchant said:
So yet again MS seems to want us to do it their way not the way we want, the excuse of better security is rubbish, they could have given us that easily in Win 10 and less of all the TPM crap.

Seems MS is learning from Apple and becoming more and more control freaks. Well at least Linux will probably gain from this and good for them. Win 10 was ok and bearable, Win 11 at the moment is just not.

The issue is there's no way MS can please everyone. I don't know who this 'we' are. I take it's you and you're claiming that it's a huge group that would want it to look and function the same way you would want it to. I doubt I would agree with you on what you want. I simply adjust to what MS supplies., IMO, it's not that hard

As for security. The more I can have the better. Oh and if you like Linux.,. have at it.

Lance1 · Jul 5, 2021

Chris Titus Tech installed Windows 11 on an incompatible system using diskpart. Cool video.

Macboatmaster · Jul 5, 2021

BunnyJ
I totally agree with your opinion , which is basically mine as well

JohnMarchant said:
So yet again MS seems to want us to do it their way not the way we want, the excuse of better security is rubbish, they could have given us that easily in Win 10 and less of all the TPM crap.

I am not saying Microsoft have it all correct, but you cannot call Trusted Platform Module - rubbish
It was in October 2016 that Microsoft insisted that all new computers sold with Windows 10 installed had to have TPM 2.0
It is for the benefit of anyone interested and not knowing the details - closely connected with Security Hash Algorithm SHA256 (Aka SHA2)

TPM recommendations - Windows Security

This topic provides recommendations for Trusted Platform Module (TPM) technology for Windows.

docs.microsoft.com

TPM 2.0 products and systems have important security advantages over TPM 1.2, including:

The TPM 1.2 spec only allows for the use of RSA and the SHA-1 hashing algorithm.
For security reasons, some entities are moving away from SHA-1. Notably, NIST has required many federal agencies to move to SHA-256 as of 2014, and technology leaders, including Microsoft and Google have announced they will remove support for SHA-1 based signing or certificates in 2017.

IMHO and I can produce no direct evidence to support it - the die was set for a new OS, back in 2016/17
Why would Microsoft continue with 10 when new versions and various updates had to cater for UEFI and traditional BIOS
32 and 64 bit
and various other variables.

It is a mistake to think that Microsoft ever officially said 10 was the last Windows
It was Gerry Nixon at an Ignite Conference
Microsoft: Windows 10 Will Be The Last Version | www.infopackets.com

Tiles, Notifications, and Action Center | Microsoft Ignite 2015 | Channel 9 (msdn.com)
by Jerry Nixon
Jerry Nixon | Speakers | Channel 9 (msdn.com)
Microsoft never confirmed it and it appears now that Nixon - meant the last - meaning the latest
rather than there will never be another windows.

Winuser · Jul 5, 2021

Lance1 said:
Chris Titus Tech installed Windows 11 on an incompatible system using diskpart. Cool video.

MS has relaxed the requirements to install the Dev builds of Windows 11 so why the need for Diskpart? When MS releases Windows 11 to the public then we will know what devices can install Windows 11.

24c · Jul 5, 2021

I keep Acronis images of both machines so I am just a quick recovery away from "all good"

Joe Shades · Jul 5, 2021

Lance1 said:
And waiting for at lest a year for MS to get there sh&% right? I'm dropping off the Windows 11 map for at least a year. It's a cool looking GUI but! To many thing give me issues. My Motto "If It Don't Work Don't use It" For the most part it dose to a point! But... It needs refinement and it's not for me right now. All my systems are back on Ghost Spectre Windows 10 21H1 Superlight. If you need a link, request it.

OFF The Map.

What are your issues?

JohnMarchant · Jul 6, 2021

BunnyJ said:
The issue is there's no way MS can please everyone. I don't know who this 'we' are. I take it's you and you're claiming that it's a huge group that would want it to look and function the same way you would want it to. I doubt I would agree with you on what you want. I simply adjust to what MS supplies., IMO, it's not that hard

As for security. The more I can have the better. Oh and if you like Linux.,. have at it.

Well for a start, we can't have the taskbar where we want it. We had that in WIn 10 and now 11 wants it to stay at the bottom. There have been more than enough complaints about just that alone. Most people want the UI to look the way they choose, using the colour they choose, i'm not asking for them to change icons or anything deep.

Linux, well i wish i could however some of the software i use does not run on Linux as such, some can be hacked but that brings up other problems.

Win 11 looks and feels to me like less control for the user and more geared towards tablets/surface and such. I have smartphones and pads to do that, i don't want or need it on my daily working desktop.

I agree MS will not and could not please everyone, but explain to me why they step backwards by taking away such a simple thing as where i want the task bar. As i said sounds more like Apple control freakery to me and the reason of many that i stopped using a MAC some years ago.

JohnMarchant · Jul 6, 2021

Macboatmaster said:
BunnyJ
I totally agree with your opinion , which is basically mine as well

I am not saying Microsoft have it all correct, but you cannot call Trusted Platform Module - rubbish
It was in October 2016 that Microsoft insisted that all new computers sold with Windows 10 installed had to have TPM 2.0
It is for the benefit of anyone interested and not knowing the details - closely connected with Security Hash Algorithm SHA256 (Aka SHA2)

TPM recommendations - Windows Security

This topic provides recommendations for Trusted Platform Module (TPM) technology for Windows.

docs.microsoft.com

TPM 2.0 products and systems have important security advantages over TPM 1.2, including:

The TPM 1.2 spec only allows for the use of RSA and the SHA-1 hashing algorithm.

For security reasons, some entities are moving away from SHA-1. Notably, NIST has required many federal agencies to move to SHA-256 as of 2014, and technology leaders, including Microsoft and Google have announced they will remove support for SHA-1 based signing or certificates in 2017.

IMHO and I can produce no direct evidence to support it - the die was set for a new OS, back in 2016/17
Why would Microsoft continue with 10 when new versions and various updates had to cater for UEFI and traditional BIOS
32 and 64 bit
and various other variables.

It is a mistake to think that Microsoft ever officially said 10 was the last Windows
It was Gerry Nixon at an Ignite Conference
Microsoft: Windows 10 Will Be The Last Version | www.infopackets.com

Tiles, Notifications, and Action Center | Microsoft Ignite 2015 | Channel 9 (msdn.com)
by Jerry Nixon
Jerry Nixon | Speakers | Channel 9 (msdn.com)
Microsoft never confirmed it and it appears now that Nixon - meant the last - meaning the latest
rather than there will never be another windows.

For Security, How Bad are TPMs and How Good is the Apple T2 Chip?

The TPM (Trusted Platform Module) chip in your computer is perhaps a forgotten device. It often sits there not doing much, and never quite…

medium.com

I totally agree, maybe not rubbish but not particularly good and it also come with other problems. Telemetry being one of them, many people do not like to be tracked. Now you could argue then best to just stay off the internet or at least use a different computer. There is far to much unnecessary tracking and telemetry data being gathered now.

BunnyJ · Jul 6, 2021

JohnMarchant said:
Well for a start, we can't have the taskbar where we want it. We had that in WIn 10 and now 11 wants it to stay at the bottom. There have been more than enough complaints about just that alone. Most people want the UI to look the way they choose, using the colour they choose, i'm not asking for them to change icons or anything deep.

Linux, well i wish i could however some of the software i use does not run on Linux as such, some can be hacked but that brings up other problems.

Win 11 looks and feels to me like less control for the user and more geared towards tablets/surface and such. I have smartphones and pads to do that, i don't want or need it on my daily working desktop.

I agree MS will not and could not please everyone, but explain to me why they step backwards by taking away such a simple thing as where i want the task bar. As i said sounds more like Apple control freakery to me and the reason of many that i stopped using a MAC some years ago.

This is the very first version of 11 to see the light of day from MS and you can't expect every feature from 10 to be in it yet. If you want to complain.. go to the feedback hub and have at it. We got your point from the first post here on.

As for Linux.. you can try to run the apps/software on it via Wine..

Lastly, you can still use Win 10 for at least 4 more years.. if you don't like 11 so much I would suggest you use 10 for now.

BunnyJ · Jul 6, 2021

JohnMarchant said:
For Security, How Bad are TPMs and How Good is the Apple T2 Chip?

The TPM (Trusted Platform Module) chip in your computer is perhaps a forgotten device. It often sits there not doing much, and never quite…

medium.com

I totally agree, maybe not rubbish but not particularly good and it also come with other problems. Telemetry being one of them, many people do not like to be tracked. Now you could argue then best to just stay off the internet or at least use a different computer. There is far to much unnecessary tracking and telemetry data being gathered now.

RickC · Jul 6, 2021

I've been taking it out for a dance around the floor and - so far - I must admit that I'm not all that impressed by what appears to be mainly badly-thought-out cosmetic changes.

One example: I'm getting older... and I right-click on a file. Now I have to remember the meaning of each icon which was previously labelled with their text alternatives of 'cut', 'paste', 'delete', etc.

Why do I now have to remember the meaning of each icon with no text labels? What was wrong with 'Cut', 'Copy', 'Paste' text descriptions of functionality?

Next it will be emojis. Probably a kitten with a paw behind its ear to signify 'copy'. Perhaps a pomegranate to signify 'paste'. Why? I don't know. My ramblings make as much sense as MS's UI design decisions.

It just seems to be an undercover attempt to cut older users out of Windows 11 by making it more unusable, especially for people with the beginnings of cognitive decline.

MS has just made it much harder, not easier. Why?

Did Microsoft get rid of all their 'Usability Acceptance Testers' at the same time they sacked all their Win 10 product testers?

Fabler2 · Jul 6, 2021

I'll be leaving Windows 10

.

RickC · Jul 6, 2021

Fabler2 said:
I'll be leaving Windows 10 View attachment 2116

.

I'm way too old to - what is it - 'roll with the dude'.

I just want a rock-solid OS that doesn't change itself all by itself more often than I change my underwear and which I can just run the programs I want to run, with no interference by some twerp of an organisation that purports to know better than me what I want to do.

From first looks, I suspect Windows 11 will show a further decline in users unless MS gets it act together.

JohnMarchant · Jul 6, 2021

BunnyJ said:
This is the very first version of 11 to see the light of day from MS and you can't expect every feature from 10 to be in it yet. If you want to complain.. go to the feedback hub and have at it. We got your point from the first post here on.

As for Linux.. you can try to run the apps/software on it via Wine..

Lastly, you can still use Win 10 for at least 4 more years.. if you don't like 11 so much I would suggest you use 10 for now.

Of course its the first version and who is to say one way or another what will come down the road. I've heard talk of scaling back on the whole TPM thing in the future. I already use the feedback hub and have done for a number of years.

I also wonder how games companies are going to fair with Win 11, because some of the new security features are really going to impact online gaming. Funny thing is i use some software which i have been happily using with Win 10 for 4 years. I installed Windows 11 which was fine then when i tried to run this software Windows recommends using compatibly mode, but the real kicker is its recommends Windows 8, i really had to laugh, probably one of the worst OS ever created after Vista.

Some software i use already have Linux versions, however some do not, but will still run with some hacking. My priority is that whatever OS it has to be able to access all 256 GB Memory, both RTX 3070 Graphics cards, whilst still be able to run my water cooled system in both CPU and GPU.

From what i am reading many people have had problems with some software here and there, not to surprising i suppose, but it also shows that Windows 10 and 11 are two totally different beats under the hood.

Fabler2 · Jul 6, 2021

RickC said:
I'm way too old to - what is it - 'roll with the dude'.

I just want a rock-solid OS that doesn't change itself all by itself more often than I change my underwear and which I can just run the programs I want to run, with no interference by some twerp of an organisation that purports to know better than me what I want to do.

From first looks, I suspect Windows 11 will show a further decline in users unless MS gets it act together.

At 67 I don't think I'm way too old, just like the early version of 11 and sure it will mature to a good OS.

JohnMarchant · Jul 6, 2021

Fabler2 said:
At 67 I don't think I'm way too old, just like the early version of 11 and sure it will mature to a good OS.

Being someone in their 60's as well i can only hope you are right. Windows 10 eventually did after soom teething troubles, its still not perfect but its also a worthy successor to Windows 7, we won't mention Windows 8. Just hope they don't follow their previous trend for one good then the next one bad, followed by another good.

brummyfan · Jul 6, 2021

RickC said:
I've been taking it out for a dance around the floor and - so far - I must admit that I'm not all that impressed by what appears to be mainly badly-thought-out cosmetic changes.

One example: I'm getting older... and I right-click on a file. Now I have to remember the meaning of each icon which was previously labelled with their text alternatives of 'cut', 'paste', 'delete', etc.

Why do I now have to remember the meaning of each icon with no text labels? What was wrong with 'Cut', 'Copy', 'Paste' text descriptions of functionality?

Next it will be emojis. Probably a kitten with a paw behind its ear to signify 'copy'. Perhaps a pomegranate to signify 'paste'. Why? I don't know. My ramblings make as much sense as MS's UI design decisions.

It just seems to be an undercover attempt to cut older users out of Windows 11 by making it more unusable, especially for people with the beginnings of cognitive decline.

MS has just made it much harder, not easier. Why?

Did Microsoft get rid of all their 'Usability Acceptance Testers' at the same time they sacked all their Win 10 product testers?