Program disappeared from laptop

Hazel123 · May 15, 2024

I use idrive, which is installed on the laptop and does daily updates. Tonight I went to do a manual backup before doing Windows updates, only to find the icon had disappeared from the desktop. Checking in the programs list it was no longer there or installed. So I reinstalled it.

How could an installed program just disappear from the laptop without me uninstalling it? (Which clearly I didn't do!).

Catnip · May 15, 2024

Occasionally, Windows Update will remove programs and apps that MS deems to be "incompatible".

It happens to my laptop all the time. I have a number of older scientific and engineering apps on it, and every so often MS just decides to take them out when there is an update. Then I have to re-install them. It's such a PITA. The apps work fine, but they are from the Win 7 days and I guess MS just doesn't like them. I suspect that I will have to re-install all of them in the morning again, since I did updates before I left work today.

Grrrrr.

antspants · May 15, 2024

Catnip said:
Occasionally, Windows Update will remove programs and apps that MS deems to be "incompatible".

I have also read of instances of this happening in here. I couldn’t find any incompatible references to idrive online.

Catnip · May 15, 2024

antspants said:
I have also read of instances of this happening in here. I couldn’t find any incompatible references to idrive online.

Yeah, it's the weirdest thing. Stuff just disappears...

antspants · May 15, 2024

Catnip said:
Yeah, it's the weirdest thing. Stuff just disappears...

Sometimes I think that Microsoft is running a social experiment and we are all lab rats

Hazel123 · May 16, 2024

I am shocked to be honest. This isn't an old Windows 7 program - it's a current and bona fide program used for backup. If Windows update did remove it in the past few days, then I can only think it's because it's seen as a competitor to One Drive.

I wasn't aware of any Windows updates in the past few days, but some appeared last night so maybe some had already installed before it asked me to restart due to updates. I held off updating until I'd reinstalled the program and done a backup!

It wasn't even an app - it was a fully installed program that appears in Control panel. I am not happy!

It was nowhere to be found on the laptop and missing from Control panel - until I reinstalled it again.

Hazel123 · May 16, 2024

I guess it could be a problem at idrive's end - if they accidentally deleted the computer it was to be installed on maybe?

andrew129260 · May 16, 2024

Catnip said:
Occasionally, Windows Update will remove programs and apps that MS deems to be "incompatible".

It happens to my laptop all the time. I have a number of older scientific and engineering apps on it, and every so often MS just decides to take them out when there is an update. Then I have to re-install them. It's such a PITA. The apps work fine, but they are from the Win 7 days and I guess MS just doesn't like them. I suspect that I will have to re-install all of them in the morning again, since I did updates before I left work today.

Grrrrr.

that is very odd, I never heard or seen that happening except for cases where you install a new feature update and microsoft warns about incompatibility. But it prevents the update. If it was, I would imagine that would be a big issue with businesses like my work for instance. I have no idea what would cause that, perhaps it is falsely being flagged as malware by your antivirus and silently removed?

As for @Hazel123
What is more likely, is the program was in the middle of updating and failed (or got stuck waiting on a task without you knowing and you restarted/signed out), leaving the program uninstalled. I have seen that a few rare times with programs installers. I think that is a lot more likely than microsoft removing programs via a windows update.

Windows installer is quite limited and can only install or update a program one at a time, so in many cases if you are in the middle of installing something else, or windows is updating, it might be that the programs auto update uninstalled the program and went to install the new, and then due to the above, couldn't install the update and timed out, leaving the program uninstalled.

Event viewer could help determine if that was the case.

antspants · May 16, 2024

Windows can and has uninstalled apps/software without user interaction if it deems there are compatability issues.

And we all know that Windows can install stuff on a whim, the HP app for instance.

Hazel123 · May 16, 2024

andrew129260 said:
that is very odd, I never heard or seen that happening except for cases where you install a new feature update and microsoft warns about incompatibility. But it prevents the update. If it was, I would imagine that would be a big issue with businesses like my work for instance. I have no idea what would cause that, perhaps it is falsely being flagged as malware by your antivirus and silently removed?

As for @Hazel123
What is more likely, is the program was in the middle of updating and failed (or got stuck waiting on a task without you knowing and you restarted/signed out), leaving the program uninstalled. I have seen that a few rare times with programs installers. I think that is a lot more likely than microsoft removing programs via a windows update.

Windows installer is quite limited and can only install or update a program one at a time, so in many cases if you are in the middle of installing something else, or windows is updating, it might be that the programs auto update uninstalled the program and went to install the new, and then due to the above, couldn't install the update and timed out, leaving the program uninstalled.

Event viewer could help determine if that was the case.

Thanks. The program was fully installed and had been there for quite a few months and used daily.

andrew129260 · May 16, 2024

antspants said:
And we all know that Windows can install stuff on a whim, the HP app for instance.

That was an app from the microsoft store, which was a bug. Which made sense, as microsoft pushes apps via microsoft store quite frequently. Like new windows installs for instance, Spotify and other garbage. But I have not seen any actual windows installer programs being pushed.

antspants said:
Windows can and has uninstalled apps/software without user interaction if it deems there are compatibility issues.

I have only seen it warn and refuse to update if a program was not meeting the requirements of a new feature pack, I have not seen a program uninstall itself due to a regular windows update.

As I said, I think event viewer could help determine the cause.

I would also check if you have UAC set to the Highest Level. The default setting is easily gotten around. The highest isn't perfect, but it's much better. I get a prompt for almost anything that tries to update in the background. The changes to windows settings is the key element there. Some installed programs system services disable uac at the default level and then auto update there program and then quickly re-enable it to make things easier. This is common in antivirus programs. With UAC at its highest level, it cannot change the uac setting, so you get a prompt for what the program is trying to do. Even malwarebytes for example cant update the program without a uac prompt. (But it can update the definitions.) Of course programs can still auto update even with UAC at its max. Browsers and the like. But it just depends on how the program updates and how its written. If a service was installed with a program that was approved by UAC and runs the update service as a system service (and was coded properly), there will be no UAC prompt. Or if the program is installed to the users folder, instead of the system. No prompt or admin required as well.

Hazel123 said:
Thanks. The program was fully installed and had been there for quite a few months and used daily.

Yeah check your event viewer and see if it shows it being uninstalled and a failed install. It is most likely under the msi installer under source in the application view.

Example of teams addon to office being updated:

Video Unavailable

This video is unavailable.

streamable.com

Scott · May 16, 2024

Catnip said:
Occasionally, Windows Update will remove programs and apps that MS deems to be "incompatible".

It happens to my laptop all the time. I have a number of older scientific and engineering apps on it, and every so often MS just decides to take them out when there is an update. Then I have to re-install them. It's such a PITA. The apps work fine, but they are from the Win 7 days and I guess MS just doesn't like them. I suspect that I will have to re-install all of them in the morning again, since I did updates before I left work today.

Grrrrr.

Could these programs be ran from a second drive?

Hazel123 · May 16, 2024

andrew129260 said:
That was an app from the microsoft store, which was a bug. Which made sense, as microsoft pushes apps via microsoft store quite frequently. Like new windows installs for instance, Spotify and other garbage. But I have not seen any actual windows installer programs being pushed.

I have only seen it warn and refuse to update if a program was not meeting the requirements of a new feature pack, I have not seen a program uninstall itself due to a regular windows update.

As I said, I think event viewer could help determine the cause.

I would also check if you have UAC set to the Highest Level. The default setting is easily gotten around. The highest isn't perfect, but it's much better. I get a prompt for almost anything that tries to update in the background. The changes to windows settings is the key element there. Some installed programs system services disable uac at the default level and then auto update there program and then quickly re-enable it to make things easier. This is common in antivirus programs. With UAC at its highest level, it cannot change the uac setting, so you get a prompt for what the program is trying to do. Even malwarebytes for example cant update the program without a uac prompt. (But it can update the definitions.) Of course programs can still auto update even with UAC at its max. Browsers and the like. But it just depends on how the program updates and how its written. If a service was installed with a program that was approved by UAC and runs the update service as a system service (and was coded properly), there will be no UAC prompt. Or if the program is installed to the users folder, instead of the system. No prompt or admin required as well.

Yeah check your event viewer and see if it shows it being uninstalled and a failed install. It is most likely under the msi installer under source in the application view.

Example of teams addon to office being updated:

Video Unavailable

This video is unavailable.

streamable.com

I've changed UAC to the highest level. Event viewer doesn't show anything being uninstalled. The program was active at about 7am that morning. I found it missing around 11pm that evening and Event viewer shows when I reinstalled it. In between that, can't see much other than it mentions system restore with something to do with windows update, and an edge update.

Hazel123 · May 16, 2024

Can you see anything here? Between 0707 when idrive was active and about 2300 when I reinstalled it?

andrew129260 · May 17, 2024

You would need to look at the source for msi installer, not just the idrive. Looking through the logs there should report when it was uninstalled. But it may take some digging on your part. And without seeing the details text I wouldn't know. That would be a lot of screenshots. But look at the mis installer section there between when it was on your system and when it disappeared, and it should show.

steveg · May 17, 2024

I wonder if the "malicious software" removal tool does this on the monthly updates. If so maybe anything old that doesn't meet certain security requirements could be getting removed.

andrew129260 · May 17, 2024

steveg said:
I wonder if the "malicious software" removal tool does this on the monthly updates. If so maybe anything old that doesn't meet certain security requirements could be getting removed.

I thought about that as well, but it's extremely rare for that to have false positives, as it's usually focused on the really dangerous malware. But anything is possible.

Hazel123 · May 17, 2024

andrew129260 said:
You would need to look at the source for msi installer, not just the idrive. Looking through the logs there should report when it was uninstalled. But it may take some digging on your part. And without seeing the details text I wouldn't know. That would be a lot of screenshots. But look at the mis installer section there between when it was on your system and when it disappeared, and it should show.

The references to MSI Installer were when I reinstalled it later that night. Some time between 7am and 11.30pm it seemed to have become uninstalled. I noticed there was an Edge update - could that possibly do it?

I will probably never know what happened but it's slightly disconcerting.

andrew129260 · May 17, 2024

No an edge update would not do that. That is a long time frame unfortunately.

Try right clicking on application and choose find and type in "idrive" or uninstall or even idrive uninstall and see what references you can find.

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