System Disable Modern Standby in Windows 10 and Windows 11

Caledon Ken · Sep 23, 2023

So small update.

Since I changed from the Macrium task scheduler to the Windows Task Scheduler the backups kick off flawlessly as does the AV. (I went back and looked up why Macrium had created a scheduler and one reason was to fix backups kicking off on time with the changes in and out of daylight savings).

I still have the machine set to never sleep (MS terminology). I guess the next step would be to undo all the settings related to never sleep (MS terminology) and see if backups can initiate and run.

cytherian · Sep 24, 2023

CAUTION:

My HP ZBook Firefly 15 G7 was showing S0 modern standby and hibernate only, no deep sleep. I ran the registry edit using the .reg files as provided. And while the "powercfg /a" did show after rebooting that S3 was now enabled, my ZBook failed to go into any sleep at all. It remained on while tucked in a laptop bag for 6 hours. When I took it out it was very hot to the touch. The CPU had been cooking for hours with poor ventilation. Strangely, the event log shows nothing happening for those 6 hours. I don't know why this happened. In any event, I rolled back the changes and enabled modern standby again.

cytherian · Sep 24, 2023

cytherian said:
my ZBook failed to go into any sleep at all

I should revise this. Before I stowed my laptop the cooling fan had stopped and it looked like power was off. So perhaps it was in sleep and was somehow awakened? If so, the event viewer system log should've showed an entry, but there was none.

Try3 · Sep 24, 2023

cytherian,

I have Event viewer, Custom view definitions that make it easy for me to see records of
1 power state / sleep state transitions
2 power off & on

If you have already set things up to see all these yourself then fine. Otherwise:

1 You can import the Power - Sleep-Hibernate-S0 transitions Custom view I use for this - Import Custom view - #4 - TenForums [read from the line starting with I suggest through to that beginning On a similarly confusing note]
This Custom view definition works in both Win10 & Win11 and in both S3 Sleep computers & S0 Modern standby computers.

2 Power - Starts, shutdowns. Import method is the same. The definition is attached.

Best of luck,
Denis

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

My new Lenovo Yoga 7 Pro x - AMD platform - is running all night with fans on and I think it's nonsensical I could understand a 30/45m time when Windows runs some maintenance tasks but not 24/7.

I tried disabling S0 from Powershell but S3 did not become available and I don't see options in the BIOS to turn it on.

Does that mean I have to live with Hybernate? I will try removing the Network access from S0 and see if that helps a bit.

NONSENSICAL, Intel/Microsoft/Lenovo/AMD, please allow us to TELL our machines when to turn on and off.

Try3 · Nov 18, 2023

tony359 said:
Does that mean I have to live with Hybernate?

Yes, I'm afraid it does.

Whilst I haven't suffered from it with my two S0 Modern standby computers, lots of other people have experienced the same constant fan operations as you.
I have never noticed any solution to this.

I suggest you ask Lenovo support. They are quite responsive [I reported a problem with my new Lenovo & they called me a few days later to talk it all over].
Lenovo Customer Care UK
If they do manage to provide a solution, I urge you to post it here because it would be of great interest to many people.

I normally leave my Lenovo IdeaPad Flex 5 16 in S0 connected standby but I do use 'metered connections' to stop Windows update, Office update, ... from operating behind my back.
Turn On or Off Ethernet Network Metered Connection - ElevenForumTutorials
Turn On or Off Wi-Fi Network Metered Connection - ElevenForumTutorials

Best of luck,
Denis

cereberus · Nov 18, 2023

Try3 said:
Sorry but that video is full of rubbish e.g.
- The claim that WU will not interrupt you is misleading.
- If you are not using your computer but you leave it on then nothing on the computer interrupts you, S0 or not.

All the best,
Denis

It is a shame. PT used to be a respected journalist, but now a days is only interested in his "sales" and no longer gives a poop about quality or accuracy.

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

Thanks Denis,

I wouldn't mind the laptop using some downtime to do tasks which would otherwise burden the CPU during regular use.

What I cannot accept is to return to the laptop 12 hours later after the lid was closed and find it hot, with fans spinning at half speed and hearing Whatsapp notifications WITH THE LID CLOSED.

They need to tweak that idling or whatever they want to call it! That to me is equivalent to the "do nothing" option under "choose what closing the lid does". :)

I can try logging this with Lenovo but not holding my breath :)
Cheers!

Brink · Nov 18, 2023

tony359 said:
Thanks Denis,

I wouldn't mind the laptop using some downtime to do tasks which would otherwise burden the CPU during regular use.

What I cannot accept is to return to the laptop 12 hours later after the lid was closed and find it hot, with fans spinning at half speed and hearing Whatsapp notifications WITH THE LID CLOSED.

They need to tweak that idling or whatever they want to call it! That to me is equivalent to the "do nothing" option under "choose what closing the lid does". :)

I can try logging this with Lenovo but not holding my breath :)
Cheers!

Hello Tony,

Since you have Modern Standby, you can disable network connectivity during Modern Standby like below to see if that may help.

Enable or Disable Network Connectivity in Modern Standby in Windows 11 Tutorial

This tutorial will show you how to enable or disable network connectivity during Modern Standby while on battery and/or plugged in on a Windows 10 and Windows 11 device. In Windows 10 and Windows 11, there are two power models for PCs: S3 and Modern Standby (S0 Low Power Idle). The S3 power...

www.elevenforum.com

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

Hi Brink!

I have already, thanks, I'll see how it behaves over the next few days. I can imagine it might make a big difference if none of those online processes are going to run.

Try3 · Nov 18, 2023

tony359 said:
They need to tweak that idling or whatever they want to call it!

Tony,

Things have been made so convoluted that we have to be very careful of our terms once S0 Modern standby [aka S0 Low power idle] gets into the picture.
S0 Modern standby is not directly related to the system being idle.
Once your display is off then your computer is in S0 Modern standby [aka S0 Low power idle].

- If you set your power options to keep the display on longer then you would delay the onset of S0 Modern standby.

- If you set your power options to keep the display all the time then you would delay the onset of S0 Modern standby indefinitely.

I did a series of tests a few months ago and S0 Modern standby [aka S0 Low power idle] seems to consume about the same amount of power as a comparable computer used to in S3 Sleep, typically about 1-2WHrs in every hour it's sat there in S0 Modern standby.
If you have it set to Connected standby then you will get additional power consumption from the apps that run in that period [WU, Office update, Windows 10 EMail app, ...].

There are different phases of S0 Modern standby.
If you want your own tasks to start [such as backup tasks initiated in Task scheduler] while in S0 Modern standby then
- you have to set Power options, Sleep after to Never
- you cannot use the Start menu, Power, Sleep option or any other "sleep" command
because those things send S0 Modern standby into a later phase of power saving that inhibits all but MS-approved tasks.
Running your own tasks during S0 Modern standby will also consume power.

I've never experienced consuming so much power during S0 Modern standby that the fans have come on.

tony359 said:
I can try logging this with Lenovo but not holding my breath :)

I should also have mentioned their user forums.
Lenovo community
I don't know whether they're much cop or not.

All the best,
Denis

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

Thanks for the clarification.

My laptop is brand new with a brand new Windows 11 Pro installation.
My experience is that almost every single time the laptop has fans on (it's a Ryzen 7 so it should be the coolest of the lot compared to gen 12 intel!) and I've heard Whatsapp notifications while it's closed.

That said I haven't checked whether the laptop is being woken up by something and this has nothing to do with S0? I'll have a look.

It's still disappointing if you allow me: a standard installation should not behave like that. The average user should not have to dig into settings to prevent a closed laptop from waking up to get Whatsapp notifications :)

Try3 · Nov 18, 2023

tony359 said:
I haven't checked whether the laptop is being woken up by something

It does not wake up because it is not asleep. It is in S0 Modern standby. That is not the same as sleep.
MS-approved jobs can run in S0 Modern standby. They have not published a list but some approved jobs are known - WU, the Windows 10 EMail app.

tony359 said:
It's still disappointing

It took me five years to really get to grips with how to control S0 Modern standby.
And the whole thing is predicated on a falsehood. We, the users, are alleged to want S0 Modern standby i.e. we are alleged to want "instant on".

Denis

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

It does not wake up because it is not asleep. It is in S0 Modern standby. That is not the same as sleep.

Sorry I poorly worded that. I meant that maybe something happens that is telling the laptop to move from that 1-2W status you mentioned and go full power? Can that happen while in S0?

I'm ok with WU running when in S0 and plugged in. But not for 12 hours in a row :)

If it still misbehaves I'll move to hibernating...

And the whole thing is predicated on a falsehood. We, the users, are alleged to want S0 Modern standby i.e. we are alleged to want "instant on".

Out of curiosity, I know M* Apple machines have 'instant on', does their system behave better than this disaster?

Try3 · Nov 18, 2023

tony359 said:
I meant that maybe something happens that is telling the laptop to move from that 1-2W status you mentioned and go full power? Can that happen while in S0?

For all I know, those MS-approved jobs run & consume large amounts of power without taking the computer out of S0 Modern standby.
I don't have any of them and have not tested their behaviour.

I do deliberately rouse my computers from S0 Modern standby using scripts.
There's more info on this in my post Running scripts during S0 Modern standby - my post #86 - ElevenForum

tony359 said:
I'm ok with WU running when in S0 and plugged in. But not for 12 hours in a row :)

If it still misbehaves I'll move to hibernating

I don't end up feeling the need to hibernate my S0 Modern standby computers except when I pack them in my rucksack.
I often use a batch file as a convenient method of changing between Connected & Disconnected standby.

tony359 said:
I know M* Apple machines have 'instant on', does their system behave better than this disaster?

You know more about Apple than I do.
And nothing is instant anyway.
- It takes my main computer two seconds to wake from S3 Sleep & be ready for use.
- It takes one of my S0 Modern standby computers something like half a second to get roused from S0 Modern standby & be ready for use.
I don't regard that time difference as being at all significant.

Incidentally, I use an Event viewer, Custom view to help me investigate power state changes. I'll let you know how to do it if you are interested in investigating things that closely. But I don 't recommend it; that way madness lies.

tony359 said:
Sorry

There's no need to apologise.
It's S0 Modern standby that creates this terminology quagmire.
Oh, and it's S0 Modern standby not just S0. S0 means something else.

All the best,
Denis

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

Nope, found a warm laptop again with fans spinning with lid closed despite now being disconnected when in S0 modern standby.

Any ideas how to mitigate that before I move to Hibernating it?

Try3 · Nov 18, 2023

No, sorry.

Denis

tony359 · Nov 18, 2023

Thanks. I'll make sure I express my disappointment to Lenovo then. Finger crossed.

hdmi · Nov 18, 2023

Try3 said:
It does not wake up because it is not asleep. It is in S0 Modern standby. That is not the same as sleep.

Even so, Microsoft still calls it "wake up" nevertheless. See: Modern Standby wake sources
During a Modern Standby "sleep" session, they [Microsoft] make the distinction between waking the SoC from a deep idle state and turning the screen on. E.g., Windows Update can wake the SoC but doesn't turn on the screen, whereas mouse/keyboard/touchpad input can turn the screen on except when the lid is closed and input suppression is enabled. What's funny about it, they want you to study the modern computer's sleep behavior till you fall asleep, then when you wake up again next, it turns out that the computer didn't really sleep for very long at all... Modern standby SleepStudy
Clearly, some of us are in dire need of Transmodern Standby. But they hardly ever seem to read complaints on the Feedback Hub (probably because they are sleeping).

tony359 · Nov 19, 2023

One thing I was thinking: with my S3-enabled laptop one constant issue I had was peripherals waking up the laptop. The laptop is connected to a dock which provides charge but also connects the laptop to many more peripherals.

With S3 I could see what had woken up the laptop and take action.
Can a similar thing happen with S0? Obviously you cannot "wake" a laptop into modern standby, but can something switch it from "low power mode" to "full power mode" as it used to happen with my S3-enabled laptop?

Will powercfg - lastwake give me any useful insight?