Thoughts on Windows 11

hdmi · Oct 25, 2021

Cbleman said:
MS probably feels safe using a business model of ignoring home users because in the end, we always "come around". As I tried to illustrate in previous posts, home users will ALWAYS end up using what is served to us.

What is served to me is 3rd party software that enables me to ignore said business model. We're talking about the same business model that kills productivity in those specific work environments where the user typically doesn't have the required privilges to install any 3rd party software so, to a large degree, you got that backwards.

hdmi · Oct 25, 2021

Edwin said:
Got news for ya..., big businesses hate it when MS does a major re-design! The learning curve often costs large corporations millions!
Not to mention, the support thereof, also costs millions!

This is one of the main reasons why (very) large corporations still rely on Java EE technology (what's known as Jakarta EE these days) so significantly. Because they are the largest, they have enough money they can spend in order to avoid Mickeysoft's cloud based strategy when it comes to protecting their own core business processes against these kinds of shenanigans.

BunnyJ · Oct 25, 2021

Cbleman said:
Like I said. You can't please everyone, and I don't expect MS to try.
During the W10 release, they advertised that they listened to Users. They did. Probably most of the input came from their biggest user base (Business), and the rest were largely (but admittedly, not entirely) ignored.
I disagree with pulling features out of windows and relying on third party software to fill the void, when millions of home users are asking for them back. Especially the UI customization features.

I'm sure that there will be people who love the new release "out of the box". They don't mind an extra two or three clicks (how hard is that anyway.), and they will not miss customization features they never use. Burying commands under sub menus? Changing layouts? Remove existing features and replace them with third party software? Hey! adapt and overcome baby! learn it and "Get used to it"! Could it be better? SURE! But it's what we got.

MS probably feels safe using a business model of ignoring home users because in the end, we always "come around". As I tried to illustrate in previous posts, home users will ALWAYS end up using what is served to us. Vista is a case in point. It was NEVER fully "fixed". Every time I stuck a thumb drive into a customers machine and it said there were no drivers for it, I knew I was on a Vista machine. It always had problems. After a time, home users accepted these flaws, glitches and problems as normal. Win 11 will be the new normal. Eventually 11 users will "forget" that Windows interface used to be more customizable, and the whining will die down to a trickle. When problems start creeping in, MS will blame (who?) third party software; as they do now. That (alone) does not make MS a monster. I know MS can't listen to everyone. If they did, the OS would eventually require its own separate 2TB hard drive. Ignoring millions of home users asking for features to be brought back that used to be in windows but were removed is "Just Business". That doesn't make it right though. There needs to be some balance somewhere.

"People should not have to adapt to the software. Software should adapt to the people".
{me}

Note: Maybe it IS me. Perhaps I'm just more resistant to change than I thought. I was probably one of the last people to leave XP behind for Vista. I skipped both ME and the 8 series. I still to this day use the hard fought for up arrow in Windows Explorer.
Is Win 11 really that terrible? No.... I don't think so. There is just a lot of small stuff that rubs me the wrong way. in the end, I really don't think that the minutia will cause me to skip this edition. I want to dispel any notion gathered from the diatribe above that I am in the Win 11 hater category. I WILL miss the flexibility to tailor the user interface the way I used to though. Adapt and overcome baby!

Publishing registry hacks is not fixing the problem.
Bring back F8

Allow me to retort:

1) We don't know how many users are asking for features to be restored.. I doubt it's millions
2) "People should not have to adapt to the software. Software should adapt to the people". - Really? How many software companies ask for input for the design of their products? Very few to none. Does say... Adobe ask the users for input? No they really don't. They do fix issues brought up by the user base for say, Photoshop but that's about it.. we learn to use the new versions and adapt. It's like life.. we adapt to new situation.. if we like it or not.

Is it you? Well, yes.. you're complaining so you're the one with the issues. Is that bad? No.. but you may want to dial back your expectations a tad bit. As I say.. accept life on life's terms..

But I digress... My 2c FWIW

The-Hive · Oct 25, 2021

Here is my opinion for what it's worth... When I first tried win 11 I was very unimpressed and thought it was awful. A few weeks later I thought it was ok. Now having installed it on 3 machines without any problems along with the fact there are now tweaks and hacks about to cure things I didn't like, updates are smooth and quick every driver update and program updates have worked fine. I think it's brilliant. My only only nag is you cannot see the contents of folders on the icon so I used custom icons. I am really happy with 11

Edwin · Oct 25, 2021

BunnyJ said:
...you're complaining so you're the one with the issues...

Nuthin wrong with complaining..., look at most public reviews of consumer products..., often highly negative, if not hateful and vulgar at times!
Companies need to hear it, lest they pretend divinity and it goes straight to their heads!!!

hdmi · Oct 25, 2021

BunnyJ said:
How many software companies ask for input for the design of their products?

As a trained software developer, asking for input for the design is of vital importance, in fact it is what I do for a living.

barman58 · Oct 25, 2021

I wonder what percentage of Windows users ever modify the OS more than change the Wallpaper and maybe change the UI Colour? Most will load their applications and use the OS as it's delivered to them with their shiny new computer.

Business users will rarely have the ability to modify anything

The users here expect more out of the OS, and want as much customisation as possible but we are still only a tiny percentage of the total Windows users.

Now a lot of members here took part in the Insiders program, and got an early copy of the OS - but how many of those users actually gave microsoft Feedback on the things that they did not like, the additional steps to perform a simple action, the inability to have a function that way they preferred.

Now, if everyone who was part of the insiders program sent in a regular set of requests and comments, the changes may have been dialled back or even not made, this is despite the fact that the complete insiders program only contained a small percentage of the potential users of Windows 11

ThrashZone · Oct 25, 2021

barman58 said:
I wonder what percentage of Windows users ever modify the OS more than change the Wallpaper and maybe change the UI Colour? Most will load their applications and use the OS as it's delivered to them with their shiny new computer.

Business users will rarely have the ability to modify anything

The users here expect more out of the OS, and want as much customisation as possible but we are still only a tiny percentage of the total Windows users.

Now a lot of members here took part in the Insiders program, and got an early copy of the OS - but how many of those users actually gave microsoft Feedback on the things that they did not like, the additional steps to perform a simple action, the inability to have a function that way they preferred.

Now, if everyone who was part of the insiders program sent in a regular set of requests and comments, the changes may have been dialled back or even not made, this is despite the fact that the complete insiders program only contained a small percentage of the potential users of Windows 11

Hi,
Obviously no insiders used feedback hub/...
Otherwise start menu wouldn't be rubbish
Show more also wouldn't of existed for more than 5 minutes lol

hdmi · Oct 25, 2021

barman58 said:
The users here expect more out of the OS, and want as much customisation as possible but we are still only a tiny percentage of the total Windows users.

I don't subscribe to that club. I want as few customizations as possible, but not fewer.

tomdsr · Oct 25, 2021

ThrashZone said:
Hi,
Obviously no insiders used feedback hub/...
Otherwise start menu wouldn't be rubbish
Show more also wouldn't of existed for more than 5 minutes lol

Has microsoft really ever listened?

Edwin · Oct 25, 2021

Another example:
Brink's Copy Contents To Clipboard...,
... one of the handiest frickin features ever, since sliced bread...
... how the heck you gonna inject that into that modern Menu!?!?!?

hdmi · Oct 25, 2021

tomdsr said:
Has microsoft really ever listened?

I think they must be addicted to listening (to theirself at least).

larc919 · Oct 25, 2021

hdmi said:
I think they must be addicted to listening (to theirself at least).

It has always seemed to me that Microsoft thinks they know better what we need than we do. Given the choice of deciding how something should be handled or leaving it up to us, they will opt for the former nearly every time. We lose more control with every new version of Windows.

BunnyJ · Oct 25, 2021

hdmi said:
As a trained software developer, asking for input for the design is of vital importance, in fact it is what I do for a living.

Oh.. I was a programmer for years and while we got input I don't expect MS to take my input seriously

The-Hive · Oct 25, 2021

@BunnyJ How is the computer? have you got your new motherboard yet?

BunnyJ · Oct 25, 2021

tomdsr said:
Has microsoft really ever listened?

Yes,. they have

BunnyJ · Oct 25, 2021

The-Hive said:
@BunnyJ How is the computer? have you got your new motherboard yet?

I have parts coming in from a member here.

ThrashZone · Oct 25, 2021

Hi,
Win-11 still messing up permissions on other drives

Made 2 folders on a hdd for system images on one win-11 pro x299 system

Tried to create an image to that hdd on a different win-11 pro machine z490 and reflect winpe failed with write error lol

@Brink hate to bother you but this is some weird rubbish win-11 is doing could you test this ?
Hdd formated mbr/ ntfs/ primary pretty basic

Rebuilt mbr.... and made the folders on win-7 and system image successful lol

Brink · Oct 25, 2021

ThrashZone said:
Hi,
Win-11 still messing up permissions on other drives

Made 2 folders on a hdd for system images on one win-11 pro x299 system

Tried to create an image to that hdd on a different win-11 pro machine z490 and reflect winpe failed with write error lol

@Brink hate to bother you but this is some weird rubbish win-11 is doing could you test this ?
Hdd formated mbr/ ntfs/ primary pretty basic

Rebuilt mbr.... and made the folders on win-7 and system image successful lol