Shutting down my machines

ICIT2LOL · Jul 24, 2023

This is probably a dumb query but I have seen a video and texts that say that a straight shut down at the end of the day is not a true shut down and one should reboot the machine first then shut down because the memory stays clogged with the previous session one has been having.
So which is the right thing to do because I thought that a shut down clears the memory anyway? and rebooting is not necessary.

Porthos · Jul 24, 2023

ICIT2LOL said:
I have seen a video and texts that say that a straight shut down at the end of the day is not a true shut down

That is due to fast start in Windows.
Turn On or Off Fast Startup in Windows 11 Tutorial

Optionally, if you do not wish to disable fast start, you can hold the shift button while you click shut down each time.

ICIT2LOL · Jul 24, 2023

Porthos said:
Optionally, if you do not wish to disable fast start, you can hold the shift button while you click shut down each time.

Thanks mate I will give the latter a go and also thanks for the link

Steve C · Jul 25, 2023

My daily shutdowns are true shutdowns since I turn off the power at the mains plug!

Scott · Jul 25, 2023

You can make a shutdown shortcut. The /f switch force-stops all running apps so it just like a reboot.

Code:

C:\Windows\System32\shutdown.exe /s /f /t 1

cereberus · Jul 25, 2023

ICIT2LOL said:
This is probably a dumb query but I have seen a video and texts that say that a straight shut down at the end of the day is not a true shut down and one should reboot the machine first then shut down because the memory stays clogged with the previous session one has been having.
So which is the right thing to do because I thought that a shut down clears the memory anyway? and rebooting is not necessary.

People are telling you how to do a full shutdown but not really telling you if it is necessary.

The clue here is your term "clogged" which suggest Windows is clogged like a pipe reducing performance.

By retaining memory, your pc boots faster and apps frequently used start faster. In most cases, there is no downside to using faststart - Windows will reclaim memory if needed.

A few people do experience issues (mainly dual boot setups) with faststart but in general, no need to disable it.

You will always get some wannabes online trying to make out they know better than MS how to use Windows, and most of them regurgitate outdated garbage. None of them show the benefits of fast start of course.

In other words, do not believe everything you read - perhaps even my reply lol.

Try running pc with faststart on and off and make your own decision.

ICIT2LOL · Jul 25, 2023

Thanks for all of your replies I found out that the Windows 11 shut down option (right click on it) does actually shut down and empty memory as a basic feature - I never knew that before so I shall just carry on doing that.

TechnoMage2021 · Jul 25, 2023

Repeat:

Shutting down a PC should actually be a two step process. First you can shut down windows, using the shortcut as shown in the Picture above. That particular shortcut, closes all open programs, then shuts down Windows, but the power supply is still alive, and providing voltage to the motherboard. If that were not true, the physical START (Power ON) button wired into the motherboard, would not work.

Step 2: To be safe, once Windows is shut down all power should be removed from the system, like with a switchable Power Strip, (with surge suppressor). I've been using one for about 40+ years. I used to even build my own Surge Suppressed power strips. That was before they were readily available in every Walmart of hardware store.

With power still applied to the PSU in the PC, it's subject to all kinds of weird power line glitches, lightning strikes, etc.,
that can actually cause the PC to turn on my itself at odd hours.

So, first shut down Windows, then shut down the PC itself, by pulling the plug or switching it OFF at a power strip.
RAM only remembers what's beet written to it while power is applied. Remove the power and it forgets everything.

That's just computer Kindergarten.

TM

ICIT2LOL · Jul 25, 2023

TechnoMage2021 said:
To be safe, once Windows is shut down all power should be removed from the system

Yes TM but my machine is laptop and it would just switch to battery??

TechnoMage2021 · Jul 26, 2023

Einstein was, of course, correct. I AM a genius, but even I have my limits. ROFLMAO

Some laptops will run just fine, without the main battery, as long as the external power supply is plugged in to line power.
Of course, I don't know if yours will, or not. Have you ever tried it?

Shutting down Windows is a function of Windows itself, independent of the hardware it's running on.
So if Windows is not shutting down correctly, even with the Shortcut previously given, then something is WRONG in Windows.

In a laptop, I'd replace the hard drive with a scratch drive (a spare that I have on hand) and do a Clean install of Windows.
And without any MS updates, test the Windows Shutdown function. That would either prove or disprove that the laptop hardware had anything to do with it. At that point, a full RESET of the BIOS might be in order.

I'd just keep on trying things till I'd get to the bottom of the problem.

Recently, I had an old Toshiba laptop that appeared to be having 'Old Timers Disease'. I just got tired of futzing with it, and it wound up in the trash can. (minus its battery, ram and HD, of course)
No harm done...I seem to remember it was actually a "Dumpster Find" years ago. It did give me several years of good operation, right here at this very location.

Cheers Mate!
TM

TechnoMage2021 · Aug 20, 2023

ICIT2LOL said:
This is probably a dumb query but I have seen a video and texts that say that a straight shut down at the end of the day is not a true shut down and one should reboot the machine first then shut down because the memory stays clogged with the previous session one has been having.
So which is the right thing to do because I thought that a shut down clears the memory anyway? and rebooting is not necessary.

Maybe someone out there needs a short course in RAM Memory 101.

By their very design and build, Random Access Memory chips, or RAM, can only retain their little ones and zeros in the proper order when power of the correct voltage is applied to the chip. Remove the power and the chip goes DEAD. Nothing is retained!

Long ago, Microsoft built in to Windows a routine called simply "Shutdown.exe". It's designed to properly close files, empty buffers and when ready send a command to the PSU to shut down the operating voltages, turn off the lights and fans and get quiet.
However unknown to most users, there is still DC power being generated inside the PSU and applied to the PC's motherboard.
At that point, the consciencious operator will kill all power to the PC, usually via a switchable power strip. That isolates the PC from the power line and any surges, spikes, noise, etc. that could possibly trigger a response from the PSU.
Only when all power is removed, is the PC truly shut down.

To further simplify the shutdown process, and make it just a One Click operation, I created a shortcut to the Shutdown.exe program, using this syntax: %windir%\System32\shutdown.exe /s /t 1
There are two options to this program, where /s tells the program you want to Shutdown the PC and /r would tell the program that you want to REBoot the PC. Then you have the /t option, which tells the program to Terminate all running programs and finally the number 1. That's the delay time for the operation.

I've placed my own Quick Shutdown shortcut in my Taskbar, right next to my START button, for a very quick and simple One Click shutdown.

My typical shutdown times run between five and ten seconds, depending.....

Winuser · Aug 20, 2023

TechnoMage2021 said:
the consciencious operator will kill all power to the PC, usually via a switchable power strip. That isolates the PC from the power line and any surges, spikes, noise, etc. that could possibly trigger a response from the PSU.

If one is worried about power surges they should unplug the computer from the outlet. One should also unplug any outside sources such as the Ethernet cable. A strong enough power surge can jump past switces and still fry your device. Even a surge protector isn't 100% safe.

ICIT2LOL · Aug 20, 2023

TechnoMage2021 said:
Maybe someone out there needs a short course in RAM Memory 101.

By their very design and build, Random Access Memory chips, or RAM, can only retain their little ones and zeros in the proper order when power of the correct voltage is applied to the chip. Remove the power and the chip goes DEAD. Nothing is retained!

Long ago, Microsoft built in to Windows a routine called simply "Shutdown.exe". It's designed to properly close files, empty buffers and when ready send a command to the PSU to shut down the operating voltages, turn off the lights and fans and get quiet.
However unknown to most users, there is still DC power being generated inside the PSU and applied to the PC's motherboard.
At that point, the consciencious operator will kill all power to the PC, usually via a switchable power strip. That isolates the PC from the power line and any surges, spikes, noise, etc. that could possibly trigger a response from the PSU.
Only when all power is removed, is the PC truly shut down.

To further simplify the shutdown process, and make it just a One Click operation, I created a shortcut to the Shutdown.exe program, using this syntax: %windir%\System32\shutdown.exe /s /t 1
There are two options to this program, where /s tells the program you want to Shutdown the PC and /r would tell the program that you want to REBoot the PC. Then you have the /t option, which tells the program to Terminate all running programs and finally the number 1. That's the delay time for the operation.

I've placed my own Quick Shutdown shortcut in my Taskbar, right next to my START button, for a very quick and simple One Click shutdown.

My typical shutdown times run between five and ten seconds, depending.....

Thanks Technomage I might try and follow your instructions as I am only semi savvy with computers. I still think one should not have to go to these lengths to achieve what is basically a ordinary command to shut the computer down.

Porthos · Aug 20, 2023

ICIT2LOL said:
I still think one should not have to go to these lengths to achieve what is basically a ordinary command to shut the computer down.

Just turn off fast start as I posted earlier. Then you just shut down normally like any pre Windows 8 system.

TechnoMage2021 · Aug 21, 2023

So what are you calling, "Normally"? Windows has always had several, optional places from which you could shut down the OS. Some were easier to get to than others.
I met one old lady that never did get it figured out. She would just hold down the Power button till the PC shut down.
Since so far back I can't even remember anymore, I've been doing the ONE CLICK shutdown.
I remember the syntax changing somewhere around Windows 98, but it's still a one click shutdown.
I'm sorry if that offends anyone's purist sensibilities. But it saves time and when you're done for the day and just want that PC to be DOWN, COLD, and QUIET, a Quick Shutdown Icon on the Taskbar does the trick.

barman58 · Aug 28, 2023

I tend to just switch off the monitor - I occasionally reboot the system itself when I see a reason to do so. I've been conditioned from many years of managing Server systems in offices and continuous operation plant control systems, which are usually 24/7 Targeted up time :wink: