Looking for a program for making a new homepage / Web-design program... as i have forgotten HTML coding. :-)

Hi forum

I have had homepages/website since the mid 90's up to 2015.... and back in the mid 90's you had to learn code as they didn't have any flashy homepage design programs.... And then they came in the 00's and you got lazy using the program and then just edit/clean the code afterwards. The big downside was as you didn't code, you forgot about that.. and i dont remember all code for HTML CSS, Scripts etc today.. most of it is gone.

I loved Kompozer as it was a clean program and open source.. it was nice and easy to switch between code and graphic mode... Really nice piece of software.

The problem is that web-design has changed a bit the last 15years. *LOL* So even if Kompozer still is useable for basic things, it is wayyyy too outdated as final release was 2006 or 2007.... I used that one for my last page i made in 2008 or 2009 and I took that one down 2015 as it was to old fashioned

So my question to you guys & girls here on ElevenForum.
What webdesign program/programs do you know of and recommend, or just know of, that is kind of modern... at least newer then 2015+ish.

Software for both Windows or Linux works for me.... Not Mac software though, as i dont have a Mac computer at home or a Hackintosh...
Payed.. Free... open source or closed source, you name it.. if you have an idea.. I will be glad if you post it.

Thanks in advance



Tiny note: (I already have a domains and a web-server, so i dont need an solution, just a webdesign program so to speak to build my page.)




Edit
Page two is almost totally off topic.
and it is okay

Moborise is a drag drop advanced design app, it will cost you about $100 a year. The things to note about it:
You often feel like a beta tester (check moborise web forum)
If you design a site and want to make changes, you’ll need to make sure your subscription is current. You could edit it in something like dreamweaver but… In fact, I don’t know why I am suggesting it. You can however use the free version with restrictions but will have to do a search for their web address which they hide in everything, in the code, in unmodified links… everywhere.

Squarespace is an all round option, because you’re paying for the designer and the hosting in the same package. I am about to embark on designing & setting a site up for someone using Squarespace because I no longer offer web design services, meaning I no longer write code. I can’t tell you the pricing just yet.

The other option worth considering is a template from somewhere like Elgarto. Cheap enough, very professional but then you’re back to square one, a design program will be needed.

I am now wondering why I tried to help, my input rounds up to being unhelpful, really… lol


Consider Squarespace.

antspants said:

Moborise is a drag drop advanced design app, it will cost you about $100 a year. The things to note about it:
You often feel like a beta tester (check moborise web forum)
If you design a site and want to make changes, you’ll need to make sure your subscription is current. You could edit it in something like dreamweaver but… In fact, I don’t know why I am suggesting it. You can however use the free version with restrictions but will have to do a search for their web address which they hide in everything, in the code, in unmodified links… everywhere.

Squarespace is an all round option, because you’re paying for the designer and the hosting in the same package. I am about to embark on designing & setting a site up for someone using Squarespace because I no longer offer web design services, meaning I no longer write code. I can’t tell you the pricing just yet.

The other option worth considering is a template from somewhere like Elgarto. Cheap enough, very professional but then you’re back to square one, a design program will be needed.

I am now wondering why I tried to help, my input rounds up to being unhelpful, really… lol


Consider Squarespace.

Click to expand...

I always appreciates conversations too

I looked at Moborise and it dont seem to have an option to switch/tab over to the html code..
I did learn back then that web-design program almost always leaves a lot of crap in the code, so it needs some cleaning up, so to speak...
so its nice to have the html code reachable from within the program, so you dont need to open a text editor to view the code.

Marie SWE said:

I always appreciates conversations too

I looked at Moborise and it dont seem to have an option to switch/tab over to the html code..
I did learn back then that web-design program almost always leaves a lot of crap in the code, so it needs some cleaning up, so to speak...
so its nice to have the html code reachable from within the program, so you dont need to open a text editor to view the code.

Click to expand...

Mobirise has a code plugin. Have you thought about Squarespace? But I don’t think it would have a code switch, not sure… yet

There are many extensions (and my bad spelling) for MOBIRISE. There are also people making blocks (drag/drop blocks) outside of the company. Some offer them in the forum which the company seems fine with, extensions also. Some sell the extensions.
There are a lot of free templates but that is all they are, templates. I don’t believe that have any real function, which is stupid. For instance, a booking template that can’t actually take bookings…
The extensions and templates come with a Mobirise subscription, or you can buy them separately, but why would you? They bring out some new ones mid subscription which they expect you to pay for, templates mainly. But if there is a new one you really want, contacting them they will do low prices And add it to your subscription.

One more thing… Mobirise is ALWAYS between 90 to 99% off. They think we’re silly.

This may, or may not, help you, but I have never depended on a flashy design program to create my web pages. I have tried a few and have found them all lacking. I have had a web site, K7MEM.com, since around 2004 and have always written my pages manually. Over the years, I have heavily changed the basic design and layout of my pages. The main utility that I use is the free version HTMLKit 292. It's mostly a text style editor that is sensitive to HTML, CSS, and Javascript. If you are editing HTML, CSS, I believe you can also use Notepad++, which can also be made sensitive to HTML and CSS. Mostly, I use Notepad++ for editing C, C++, GAWK, MC6800 Assembly, Verilog, shell script (SH), etc. files, when I am working in Cygwin64.

Over the years, I have developed a HTML template that I use on all my pages. When I need to add a new web page, I just make a copy of the template, rename it, add it to my main menu, and then develop it locally using HTMLkit and a web browser, for graphic display. I use Chrome, but you can use whatever browser you want to check your development. HTMLkit has a built in graphic display, but I prefer using a web browser. Once I am done developing my new page(s) I upload the new page files to my web site using Filezilla. For me, this means uploading (FTP) a ".html" file, a ".css" file, a ".js" file and new main menu file (.js). This usually takes less than 30 seconds. Once the menu file is uploaded, the new page is automatically part of the main menu and the web site. I seldom actually have to log into my web host except to pay the rental on the domains and hosting.

You are correct, web page design has changed a lot over the years, so it is difficult to know all of the HTML/CSS structures. I keep up on it by having a quickly accessible link to W3Schools.com. Usually a quick search on that site tells me everything I need to know. They have lots of tutorials and examples.

In you note, you mentioned you have a web server. Is that your own personal web server or are you using a web host? I ask this because, I use DreamHost for my domains and hosting. DreamHost has a built in web page design capability available to users. I have never used it, but it is available. Does your web host have the same capability?

Over the years, the biggest headache I had was with the site menu. As I added more and more pages, it was difficult to keep up with the site menu changes because, every page had to be changed and uploaded, every time I added a new page. However, I finally created a site menu using Javascript that is sourced by all pages and automatically updates when I upload a new page. Once I add one page to the menu, all pages get the same menu change. This also allows me to put pages on my site that are not directly accessible to the public, until I add them to the common menu on the web site

For someone who's been in the business as long as I've been, I'm not too proud to admit that I still run Dreamweaver MX2004 on occasion once maybe every 9 months.
HTML is pretty much base for anything XHTML, DHTML, and so on and so forth.
I do a lot of work fixing stuff for people -- If I run into source code that's overwhelmingly commented or is sloppy (unclosed tags that modern browsers ignore for instance) I'll load it up in the Dreamweaver and it can not only remove superfluous and broken HTML, it also formats it all in seconds - even the so-called *modern writes. (nobody formats anymore).

A lot of simple code these days is still just XHTML and the old Dreamweaver is the only out-of-the-box editor (that I've seen) that handles it effectively.

Though the Dreamweaver is older and loads the charset and xhtml1-transitional tags by default (for template writes), I just drop those and write the simple HTML tag, which is what nearly 99% of the static site builds are written with these days - closing tags are written a bit differently but they are the same when you open your browser - Modern browsers will read </> just like they'll read < />.
Other than the fact that we don't write tables or framesets anymore, not that much has changed.

A lot of the newer code editors miss quite a bit and aren't nearly as flexible. On the other hand, if one were used to using a newer editor and that's all they knew, then that solution would be the one that works the best for them.

I used to depend on the code editor quite a bit back in the 90's and only bought the Dreamweaver because I was trying to get my head wrapped around DHTML (DHTML was sort of a flash in the pan because nobody writes that anymore either)

*I might suggest that if you ever get the chance to snag up on the Dreamweaver software, do it.
Adobe bought out Macromedia and killed it - Dreamweaver MX2004 was built by Macromedia.
Back in the day I bought both Dreamweaver and Photoshop -- Fast forward to 2013 and Adobe shut the activation servers when it went SaaS and passed out free activation codes for both Photoshop and Dreamweaver. You might want to look into that because back in the day, these companies built the best that ever was.*

Not only does Dreamweaver provide you with the base code for HTML, it will also assist greatly in giving the basic frameworks for your more popular and better known PHP, ASP, ASP Javascript, JSP, Cold Fusion, CSS, and more.

Though there be variations in the code (including CSS) over time, the base code never changes.

As an aside, direct ftp to your hosting space or server would be highly recommended - it's faster, more secure, and uses less resources.

Also, Dreamweaver works on MacOS, Linux (WINE), Windows 11, and all of the other associated previous MACOS and Microsoft OS builds.

Nothing wrong with dreamweaver. Always has been a brilliant program in my opinion. Not that I’ve used it in the past 5 years. Having said that, outide of being paid, my passion was creating CSS driven table-less/Frameless websites. All years and a couple of heart attacks ago now.

antspants said:

Mobirise has a code plugin. Have you thought about Squarespace? But I don’t think it would have a code switch, not sure… yet

Click to expand...

Its out of the question.. I want to design my own page.. Thats why i ruled out wordpress as you dont have the control.
I still appropriate your input as others might have use of everything we talk about in here.

antspants said:

There are many extensions (and my bad spelling) for MOBIRISE. There are also people making blocks (drag/drop blocks) outside of the company. Some offer them in the forum which the company seems fine with, extensions also. Some sell the extensions.
There are a lot of free templates but that is all they are, templates. I don’t believe that have any real function, which is stupid. For instance, a booking template that can’t actually take bookings…
The extensions and templates come with a Mobirise subscription, or you can buy them separately, but why would you? They bring out some new ones mid subscription which they expect you to pay for, templates mainly. But if there is a new one you really want, contacting them they will do low prices And add it to your subscription.

One more thing… Mobirise is ALWAYS between 90 to 99% off. They think we’re silly.

Click to expand...

Yeah.. that thing with working with templates.. it is not me that decide how it should look like.
as far i saw it was free.. at least on the swedish page i was redirected to.

K7MEM said:

This may, or may not, help you, but I have never depended on a flashy design program to create my web pages. I have tried a few and have found them all lacking. I have had a web site, K7MEM.com, since around 2004 and have always written my pages manually. Over the years, I have heavily changed the basic design and layout of my pages. The main utility that I use is the free version HTMLKit 292. It's mostly a text style editor that is sensitive to HTML, CSS, and Javascript. If you are editing HTML, CSS, I believe you can also use Notepad++, which can also be made sensitive to HTML and CSS. Mostly, I use Notepad++ for editing C, C++, GAWK, MC6800 Assembly, Verilog, shell script (SH), etc. files, when I am working in Cygwin64.

Over the years, I have developed a HTML template that I use on all my pages. When I need to add a new web page, I just make a copy of the template, rename it, add it to my main menu, and then develop it locally using HTMLkit and a web browser, for graphic display. I use Chrome, but you can use whatever browser you want to check your development. HTMLkit has a built in graphic display, but I prefer using a web browser. Once I am done developing my new page(s) I upload the new page files to my web site using Filezilla. For me, this means uploading (FTP) a ".html" file, a ".css" file, a ".js" file and new main menu file (.js). This usually takes less than 30 seconds. Once the menu file is uploaded, the new page is automatically part of the main menu and the web site. I seldom actually have to log into my web host except to pay the rental on the domains and hosting.

You are correct, web page design has changed a lot over the years, so it is difficult to know all of the HTML/CSS structures. I keep up on it by having a quickly accessible link to W3Schools.com. Usually a quick search on that site tells me everything I need to know. They have lots of tutorials and examples.

In you note, you mentioned you have a web server. Is that your own personal web server or are you using a web host? I ask this because, I use DreamHost for my domains and hosting. DreamHost has a built in web page design capability available to users. I have never used it, but it is available. Does your web host have the same capability?

Over the years, the biggest headache I had was with the site menu. As I added more and more pages, it was difficult to keep up with the site menu changes because, every page had to be changed and uploaded, every time I added a new page. However, I finally created a site menu using Javascript that is sourced by all pages and automatically updates when I upload a new page. Once I add one page to the menu, all pages get the same menu change. This also allows me to put pages on my site that are not directly accessible to the public, until I add them to the common menu on the web site

Click to expand...

I looked at you web page.. Clean and simple HTML code.. lightweight as it didn't have a ton of scripts.. I bet that page works great even on 1Mbit connection.

I'm planning on two pages.. one with more modern design and one with the 90's retro design, (that one is for old retro computers), so then the 90's design will give others the nostalgia flashback..
*smiling* yeah it sure has.. today's webpages feels like 99% scripting *LOL*
But some of them looks really good and is still kind of clean in the code and not toooo heavy even they do need an 10Mbit connection to not feel like you are on a dial up modem

Yeah i know i can refresh my old html coding days.. But... i dont have the time for it, as i am studying other things at the moment to get in the loop again, as my cert's i have is between 12 up to 20 years old.. so not only some of my OS's is EOL, even i am EOL at the moment. *HAHA*

I actually have a hybrid on prim/cloud solution. so i have both my own server, even that one do starts to get old, but it still performs good in this kind of lightweight stuff and i have one VPS on Bahnhof data center.

I will look more on your links a bit later tonight and your website i saw its about electronics and radio... I had one of those in the late 90's and was chasing the longest distance for communication range... Nowadays they cheat with using internet for radio communication around the globe... cheaters. *LOL*

Time for something to eat and then on to the next post

Take a look at Microsoft Expression Web. It's been abandoned by MS for several years now but should still work.

Reddwebdev said:

For someone who's been in the business as long as I've been, I'm not too proud to admit that I still run Dreamweaver MX2004 on occasion once maybe every 9 months.
HTML is pretty much base for anything XHTML, DHTML, and so on and so forth.
I do a lot of work fixing stuff for people -- If I run into source code that's overwhelmingly commented or is sloppy (unclosed tags that modern browsers ignore for instance) I'll load it up in the Dreamweaver and it can not only remove superfluous and broken HTML, it also formats it all in seconds - even the so-called *modern writes. (nobody formats anymore).

A lot of simple code these days is still just XHTML and the old Dreamweaver is the only out-of-the-box editor (that I've seen) that handles it effectively.

Though the Dreamweaver is older and loads the charset and xhtml1-transitional tags by default (for template writes), I just drop those and write the simple HTML tag, which is what nearly 99% of the static site builds are written with these days - closing tags are written a bit differently but they are the same when you open your browser - Modern browsers will read </> just like they'll read < />.
Other than the fact that we don't write tables or framesets anymore, not that much has changed.

A lot of the newer code editors miss quite a bit and aren't nearly as flexible. On the other hand, if one were used to using a newer editor and that's all they knew, then that solution would be the one that works the best for them.

I used to depend on the code editor quite a bit back in the 90's and only bought the Dreamweaver because I was trying to get my head wrapped around DHTML (DHTML was sort of a flash in the pan because nobody writes that anymore either)

*I might suggest that if you ever get the chance to snag up on the Dreamweaver software, do it.
Adobe bought out Macromedia and killed it - Dreamweaver MX2004 was built by Macromedia.
Back in the day I bought both Dreamweaver and Photoshop -- Fast forward to 2013 and Adobe shut the activation servers when it went SaaS and passed out free activation codes for both Photoshop and Dreamweaver. You might want to look into that because back in the day, these companies built the best that ever was.*

Not only does Dreamweaver provide you with the base code for HTML, it will also assist greatly in giving the basic frameworks for your more popular and better known PHP, ASP, ASP Javascript, JSP, Cold Fusion, CSS, and more.

Though there be variations in the code (including CSS) over time, the base code never changes.

As an aside, direct ftp to your hosting space or server would be highly recommended - it's faster, more secure, and uses less resources.

Also, Dreamweaver works on MacOS, Linux (WINE), Windows 11, and all of the other associated previous MACOS and Microsoft OS builds.

Click to expand...

I remember Dreamweaver I wonder if i dont have that one laying around on some of my old backups (I'm a software/data hoarder) Old software almost dont take up any space.. i think i have tons of software from MS-DOS up to win2000 or XP... and the fun thing its on one 2TB disk... and today, 10-20 bigger installers is almost an entire 2TB disk. *lol*
Did you ever tried Kompozer? or Composer as it was first before they did an open source spin-off.

Reddwebdev said:

Fast forward to 2013 and Adobe shut the activation servers when it went SaaS and passed out free activation codes for both Photoshop and Dreamweaver.

Click to expand...

what? have they passed out free activation codes for Photoshop?? Where can i find that? and what versions of Photoshop then?
I think i have Dreamweaver, But it never hurts to get hold of more activation codes for that too.. and the software if its other version that i might have on backups... IF.. if i can find it, as i dont have the best organization of my old software i only keep on backups.


Yeah that is the main problem for me.. If i open a HTML page in a text editor i recognise almost all code tags.. But i dont remember them so i can take a blank page and just start typing <head><style><title><div> etc, etc.. i just dont remember the commands.. I remember what they are and do when i read a file, but start coding.. It's just gone... The same with old MS-DOS Basic in 1989/90 i learned to program Basic and made a few home office programs.. But same there.. I can only remember a few commands.. But when i see the code i recognise what it do and so on..
It is not good to take a 20-30years break on stuff. *LOL*
So i need to cheat with software and then i can clean up the code afterwards and i might get back some of my memory's on the journey

Thanks for the tip that Dreamweaver works in wine, as more people might have use of that tip.
as for me i use my win7 computer for windows programs.. even if wine might be good(i have never tried it) windows software is just easier on windows OS as Linux software is easier on Linux even if windows have WSL.


I only got 3hours of sleep last night, so I'm seeing double and i hope i answered all without missing to much.
I will go through the thread tomorrow again after a tiny bit longer sleep.

Birk said:

Take a look at Microsoft Expression Web. It's been abandoned by MS for several years now but should still work.

Download Microsoft Expression Web - MajorGeeks

Expression Web is a full-featured professional tool for designing, developing, and publishing compelling, feature-rich websites that conform to web standards....

www.majorgeeks.com

Click to expand...

Thanks for the tip.. 2012 do sounds better then my old from 2006/2007.. I will have a closer look on it tomorrow

I used FrontPage years ago for Web page editing but when my hosting service started changing from HTML 4 to HTML 5 I got Microsoft Expression Web. It's been discontinued by Microsoft but can be downloaded from

You don’t have to use templates with Mobirise. Create your own site from scratch. It’s designed to make bootstrab web design easy.
Like Burton, I also used FrontPage, great software. But I’ve never used expression web. Dreamweaver was always my goto.

... have they passed out free activation codes for Photoshop??

Click to expand...

On a fluke, in 2014, I downloaded the page from Adobe that presented across the board activation/registration codes for:

Creative Suite 2
Acrobat 3D 1.0 for Windows
Acrobat Standard 7.0
Acrobat Pro 7.0
After Effects
Audition 3.0
GoLive CS2
Illustrator CS2
InCopy CS2
InDesign CS2
Photoshop CS2
Adobe Premiere Pro 2.0

Adobe removed the legacy downloads from their site in 2016 (the legacy downloads were open and free to the public ... as were the activation codes)

My Macromedia account was transferred over to, or merged, with my Adobe account when Macromedia was bought out.
Since the activation servers were shut, I couldn't use the activation code that came with my Dreamweaver purchase, so they gave me an activation code to use with my version of Dreamweaver that could be used whenever I wanted to install it on a different machine. Activation codes for the Macromedia product builds were legacy version specific. In other words, if you own Macromedia Dreamweaver MX2004, the activation code that I have will work.

Adobe activation codes are also legacy version build specific. (Photoshop CS2 only has one activation code for instance)

If you had purchased a different legacy version build of Dreamweaver, and you have an Adobe account, they may provide you with an activation code that's specific to your version.

Adobe still has my Photoshop CS2 and my Macromedia Dreamweaver MX2004 listed as registered on their site.

Linux Note:

If you want to run Photoshop/Dreamweaver on Linux in WINE, be sure to port the "Fonts folder" from any Microsoft installation media (98 thru 11) into the shared/common files folder in WINE -- by doing this, Photoshop/Dreamweaver will run and look exactly like they do on Windows.

Macromedia… when life was a lot less complicated.

I've been playing around with this web-based one, and it's pretty good.

Sorry for late reply guys

My fridge broke early Thursday morning, and almost no sleep, so i was really tired Thursday evening and yesterday my VPN Primary DNS went down so everything went to a crawl as every time i loaded a page it had to time out to use secondary.. so that was a fun day first trouble shoot why my internet went slow and then call the VPN provider tech support to report the error and the idiot on the phon didn't even know what a DNS is.. so that was an interesting hour i lost of my life.. 40minutes in phone queue 20minutes talking to someone non tech person and try to get that person to understand or to connect me to some one that actually know networking..... without success... so it ended with me making a workaround with the software settings to use the secondary as primary for time being..... hmmm.. i wonder if the DNS still is down..... yeah.. its still down. *lol*


Back to business

Berton said:

I used FrontPage years ago for Web page editing but when my hosting service started changing from HTML 4 to HTML 5 I got Microsoft Expression Web. It's been discontinued by Microsoft but can be downloaded from

Download Microsoft Expression Web - MajorGeeks

Expression Web is a full-featured professional tool for designing, developing, and publishing compelling, feature-rich websites that conform to web standards....

www.majorgeeks.com

Click to expand...

FrontPage.. that do sound sooooo familiar.. i need to do a duckduckgo on that one........ aha now i remember it was a part of Office
I found it is possible to download directly from microsoft too
Thanks for your input

antspants said:

You don’t have to use templates with Mobirise. Create your own site from scratch. It’s designed to make bootstrab web design easy.
Like Burton, I also used FrontPage, great software. But I’ve never used expression web. Dreamweaver was always my goto.

Click to expand...

Okay.. i need to inspect that one, one more time.
I never used Dreamweaver.. i stuck to Kompozer up to i ditched my website..

Reddwebdev said:

On a fluke, in 2014, I downloaded the page from Adobe that presented across the board activation/registration codes for:

Creative Suite 2
Acrobat 3D 1.0 for Windows
Acrobat Standard 7.0
Acrobat Pro 7.0
After Effects
Audition 3.0
GoLive CS2
Illustrator CS2
InCopy CS2
InDesign CS2
Photoshop CS2
Adobe Premiere Pro 2.0

Adobe removed the legacy downloads from their site in 2016 (the legacy downloads were open and free to the public ... as were the activation codes)

My Macromedia account was transferred over to, or merged, with my Adobe account when Macromedia was bought out.
Since the activation servers were shut, I couldn't use the activation code that came with my Dreamweaver purchase, so they gave me an activation code to use with my version of Dreamweaver that could be used whenever I wanted to install it on a different machine. Activation codes for the Macromedia product builds were legacy version specific. In other words, if you own Macromedia Dreamweaver MX2004, the activation code that I have will work.

Adobe activation codes are also legacy version build specific. (Photoshop CS2 only has one activation code for instance)

If you had purchased a different legacy version build of Dreamweaver, and you have an Adobe account, they may provide you with an activation code that's specific to your version.

Adobe still has my Photoshop CS2 and my Macromedia Dreamweaver MX2004 listed as registered on their site.

Linux Note:

If you want to run Photoshop/Dreamweaver on Linux in WINE, be sure to port the "Fonts folder" from any Microsoft installation media (98 thru 11) into the shared/common files folder in WINE -- by doing this, Photoshop/Dreamweaver will run and look exactly like they do on Windows.

Click to expand...

Okay.. Do you know if it's still possible to download those with activation codes today?
Photoshop CS2 is extra interesting, even that all is interesting to have

z3r010 said:

I've been playing around with this web-based one, and it's pretty good.

Phoenix Code | Code Creatively

A text editor designed to make coding as intuitive and fun as playing a video game - specially crafted for web developers, designers, and students.

phcode.dev

Click to expand...

I looked at that one.. it mostly look like a text editor.. like notepad++ or Kate in linux.. or did i miss the graphical part where you can insert stuff and the program makes the code?
I was kind of tired the day before yesterday when i had a look

Marie SWE said:

I looked at that one.. it mostly look like a text editor.. like notepad++ or Kate in linux.. or did i miss the graphical part where you can insert stuff and the program makes the code?
I was kind of tired the day before yesterday when i had a look

Click to expand...

Sounds like you had a fun day

I am not currently in a position to investigate properly, but if you click the icon (top right) some things pop up that I’d like to inspect further when I can. @z3r010 would know what to tell you.